Is BK Raja Yoga for the chronically low in self-esteem?

for ex-Brahma Kumaris, to discuss matters related to their experiences in BKWSU & after leaving.
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fluffy bunny
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Is BK Raja Yoga for the chronically low in self-esteem?

Post by fluffy bunny » 08 Aug 2008

Just a muse I have been having for a while. Is BK Raja Yoga a path for the chronically low in self-esteem? Is that why normal happy healthy people are not interested?

I mean ... what sort of person really has to be led to believe that they are "One of the 8" top souls in the world, destined to be a god in the Golden Age or even that God speaks to them personally in order to return their self-esteem? Is this what made some of us vulnerable? (Where as a sort of arrogance or vanity got others?).

I suppose even the Gyani answer is, yes. How long can they all hold out hoping and waiting that it is all true, that Destruction will come to save and vindicate them, and what they have gambled their entire lives and wealth on will happen?

(... and I am not excluding myself and own involvement from this consideration).

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Re: Is BK Raja Yoga for the chronically low in self-esteem?

Post by mbbhat » 11 Aug 2008

ex-l wrote:I suppose even the Gyani answer is, yes. How long can they all hold out hoping and waiting that it is all true, that Destruction will come to save and vindicate them, and what they have gambled their entire lives and wealth on will happen?
This is right to a large extent.

Logically speaking, a doctor is needed to weak patients. So, God is most necessary to more impure souls. Those who take maximum births become more weak. So, God comes to purify them. Since they get God's company they get more power, hence rule the world for more amount of time.

Weak patients agree to Doctor's prescription more easily than others. Hence the impure souls (sacrifice their ego, sometimes it increases after becoming BK when one gets guddi and due to Maya's war) surrender to God and become ready to change them. This recharges their battery.

Baba says Number one pavan is number one patit.

Actually Destruction happens naturally. But there is coincidence between the Destruction and construction, since cycle should repeat. Destruction is not the one that saves BKs. It is Baba who saves BKs. Wealth has least value in this. First man (mind), next tan, next dhan.

If we see in history, powerful people have attacked and got victory over weak people. Here (in the end) it happens NATURALLY, because BKs gain power NATURALLY (yogbal). So when BKs get natural (real) power, NATURAL calamities itself becomes a cause for the Destruction of other religions.

I know around 8 Murli points related to this, but do not have dates of them.

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Re: Is BK Raja Yoga for the chronically low in self-esteem?

Post by mr green » 11 Aug 2008

I would say, yes, ex-l. It certainly is not related to intelligence. Yes, it seems the needy like to believe.

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healthy self esteem or megalomania?

Post by alladin » 11 Aug 2008

Next, I think logical question: does Raja Yoga help people develop a long lasting, healthy kind of self esteem? If not, the temporary "delusion of grandeur", like someone defined it months ago on this Forum, can create even more damage because it leads people away from reality and "now".

I think it is worth checking out any spiritual path or therapy that promises to help us re-awaken our dormant qualities. What never attracted me much in Raja Yoga is all that artificial-sounding and full of frills stuff such as keeping in front of us the image Lakshmi, decorated with jewels and complete with crown! I know that we can look beyond that and do not have to take it literally, but why going through this?

Maybe in India it connects to some archetype that's deeply embedded in the culture and collective subconscious, so it represents a shortcut, but in the West all these masquerades may be misleading from the simple aim of empowering our Higher Self. Most of the effort Double Foreigners make, goes into copying Indian styles in everything. Sounds like a long way around, a waste of energy.

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Re: Is BK Raja Yoga for the chronically low in self-esteem?

Post by jannisder » 12 Aug 2008

What attracts is that you are something ... a jewel, a long lost child, an angel. People with no self esteem get attracted to them. All of a sudden you are "something" while in real live you were a loser maybe.

That is the power of BKWSU ... to make you feel like something you are not ...! And even tell you to keep imagining that you are some kind of special being ...

Its like telling me I am a millionaire but I cannot pay my bills.

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Re: Is BK Raja Yoga for the chronically low in self-esteem?

Post by fluffy bunny » 12 Aug 2008

jannisder wrote:Its like telling me I am a millionaire but I cannot pay my bills.
Its a good point you pick up on here, Jannisder.

I was looking at how women are known to be bigger givers/donor to charity or do more work as voluntary workers.

Women are far more likely than men to be voluntary part-time workers. Not only do women perform a higher quantity of voluntary part-time work, they also represent the majority of voluntary part-timers, e.g. although women made up 45% of a total workforce, they constituted 71% of voluntary part-time workers. They also, generally, have lower self-esteem and a much lower status in society ... especially backward ones like India.

Part of me is wondering is Lekhraj Kirpalani and Shiv deliberately targeted women for their expansion plans as they knew they would give more for less and be less of a problem. Easy pickings in other words. A few sweet words, some toli and they are "butter in one's mouth".

Ditto ... are the men that are attracted the most to the BKWSU, or are most successful within the BKWSU, effeminate or do they become effeminized by the organization and practise? That is, rather than become empowered, they become disempowered and dependent.

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Re: healthy self esteem or megalomania?

Post by mbbhat » 12 Aug 2008

alladin wrote:Next, I think logical question: does Raja Yoga help people develop a long lasting, healthy kind of self esteem? If not, the temporary "delusion of grandeur", like someone defined it months ago on this Forum, can create even more damage because it leads people away from reality and "now".
May not as one desires. But there are many people who got rid of their bad habits like drinking, smoking, etc by the influence of RajaYogis.

The aim here is marjeeva janm. Die and then live. Unless one dies (loses attachment in impure world) fully, he cannot live (enjoy RajYogi life) fully. That 's why Baba clearly says, 'just give the message of two fathers. If they get interested then only you continue".- Beacuse all cannot put such a high effort.

Baba comes to end the old world. So one who is ready to die (forget body) only can enjoy real Brahmin Life.

It is like a soldier's life. He has to maintain his health, look after his family and do any service of the country and be ready to die. For a soldier, his health is first. Then the country. Then the family.

Similary a RajYogi has to take care of his body, but should not ignore Godly service. For him, the health is swa-sthiti (mental happiness), dharna. Then Godly service, then lokik service. But still Baba says in Murli, do lokik first and then alokik.

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Re: Is BK Raja Yoga for the chronically low in self-esteem?

Post by fluffy bunny » 12 Aug 2008

Are all those big fat sisters taking care of their health?

mbbhat,

we are trying to discuss this matter seriously from a psychological point of view. Please don't us every opportunity as a pulpit. This is the ex-BK forum.

I remember the first notable BK that I knew who exited speaking. She talked about how when she joined, she was pumped up with hope and pride about herself, sold the idea that she was special, a chosen one, a would be deity and so on. When she came to question what it was all about, speak to outsiders and re-educate herself; she realised that at the time she had been enculted she was vulnerable state and that this had been taken and used.

But taking it further, when we read the testimonies of the original Mandli members, they were not individuals that one would expect to be filled with a natural self-esteem. Baba often describes them as "stone intellect" or "hunch-backed". At best they were simple women, at worst spoilt little princesses but neither with any sense of personal achievement.

And is personal achievement not taken away from individuals as a Maya and all efforts and rewards channelled into the group?

Who really needs to be cajoled with promised of golden palaces and jewelry in order to get them to do anything ... and 70 years on, what evidence do we have of spiritual greatness?

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Re: Is BK Raja Yoga for the chronically low in self-esteem?

Post by mbbhat » 12 Aug 2008

Dear ex-l soul, carry on. I have no objections.

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Re: Is BK Raja Yoga for the chronically low in self-esteem?

Post by paulkershaw » 12 Aug 2008

But there are many people who got rid of their bad habits like drinking, smoking, etc by the influence of RajaYogis.
I'd like to point out here that there are many people who have started such 'bad' habits BECAUSE of their involvement with the Raj Yogis mentioned. Just because someone chooses to drink or smoke does not neccessarily mean they have low self-esteem.

People under this syndrome often display some or at times all of the following tendencies:-

• Decreased need for sleep
• Feeling excessively good or euphoric. (This is a feeling of "being on top of the world")
• Creative thinking and heightened perceptions
• Restless or agitated feelings
Excessive energy and excitability
Jumping from one activity to the other without ever completing anything
• Rapid, unpredictable emotional changes
• Racing thoughts and flights of ideas and speech
• Hyperactivity, excessive plans and increased participation in numerous activities
• Resulting in reckless driving, spending sprees, foolish investments etc
Inflated self-esteem and Grandiose beliefs
• Self-confidence may reach the point of grandiose delusions in which one thinks one has a special connection with God, celebrities, or political leaders
• Increased sexual activity
• Inappropriate and impulsive behaviour
Poor judgment and lack of insight
Loss of touch with reality, and disorientation
Delusionary thoughts, hallucinations or even hearing of voices
• Paranoia and delusions of being persecuted
• Severe insomnia, profound weight loss and exhaustion

It has a common name though.

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