AK crazy story about peacock

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arjun
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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by arjun » 09 May 2011

anu wrote:If BKIVV cannot accept the invitation to a debate, then there must be something wrong also on AIVV's, not only on BKs. I myself have never heard that AIVV invited openly and officially BKIVV to a debate. I only heard that a package containing AK was sent to them via registered mail. I heard that some students tried to meet Dadis and Didis and Dadis Didis did not want to meet them.
Then why did you say that AIVV has never tried?
I have never heard that AIVV invited representatives of any religion to a debate. Of course, what I heard may be incomplete.
PBKs are supposed to give advanced knowledge basically to the BKs. And BKs to the general public. But many people also come directly to AIVV without becoming a BK. When BKs and PBKs unite, then we can take on the powerful religions as well. But we cannot use the same words that Baba uses in the Murlis because Murlis are narrated to the children and not to the outside world. When dealing with the souls of the outside world we have to deal with them politely. It is only when the souls become Baba's children and start losing their body consciousness that they will realize the truth about various religions. Baba does use some harsh words for various religions as well as his own children, but we are not supposed to use such harsh words because we are not free from vices ourselves.
If you evaluate people's credibility by their identity and by their identity not by facts you evaluate whether they speak truth, then I admit this is a great strange practice, very well based on the body and reminds of so called ad hominem practices. I have noticed arjun uses ad hominem sometimes.

If words contain true, they will remain true, no matter what is the identity of a person who speaks. If you want to judge, whether words are true depending on what the speaker's identity is, you are very like to commit prejudice.
Like always, whenever you face the question of identity, you shy away from answering, but never lose any chance to criticize Baba Dixit. You want to protect your identity while reserving the right to attack Baba Dixit in all possible ways. I have learnt to live with your double standards. It is OK. :cool:

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by ANU » 09 May 2011

arjun wrote:Then why did you say that AIVV has never tried?
I did not say that they never tried. I said that they did not stand up in an opne debated with BKIVV and other religious group. It is different from what you pushed in my mouth.
arjun wrote:PBKs are supposed to give advanced knowledge basically to the BKs. And BKs to the general public. But many people also come directly to AIVV without becoming a BK. When BKs and PBKs unite, then we can take on the powerful religions as well. But we cannot use the same words that Baba uses in the Murlis because Murlis are narrated to the children and not to the outside world. When dealing with the souls of the outside world we have to deal with them politely. It is only when the souls become Baba's children and start losing their body consciousness that they will realize the truth about various religions. Baba does use some harsh words for various religions as well as his own children, but we are not supposed to use such harsh words because we are not free from vices ourselves.
The teacher himself is not able to stand up face to face with those who he attacks and criticise and needs to hide after he shouts harsh words. He hismelf hides even from BKs. Facts are such that although some challenging BKs may want to go for a debate with him, he doesn't accept them and tehy will not even allowed to talk to him, because first they have to accept his point of view
arjun wrote:Like always, whenever you face the question of identity, you shy away from answering, but never lose any chance to criticize Baba Dixit. You want to protect your identity while reserving the right to attack Baba Dixit in all possible ways. I have learnt to live with your double standards. It is OK. :cool:
I have reported to the administrator that you keep offending me and accusing me of lies, despite the fact that I gave you enough answers.

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by arjun » 09 May 2011

anu wrote:I did not say that they never tried. I said that they did not stand up in an opne debated with BKIVV and other religious group. It is different from what you pushed in my mouth.
This is what you wrote on 8th May, 2011:
anu wrote:Have you ever, I means AIVV, stood for your teachings about all religions in any open debate with representatives of those religions? Have you ever stood in an open debate with BKIVV? Never.
Members can decide themselves as to who is pushing words into whose mouth.
The teacher himself is not able to stand up face to face with those who he attacks and criticise and needs to hide after he shouts harsh words. He hismelf hides even from BKs. Facts are such that although some challenging BKs may want to go for a debate with him, he doesn't accept them and tehy will not even allowed to talk to him, because first they have to accept his point of view
Baba has said in the Murlis that He will not face the world directly. It is the children who have to face the world because He talks only to his egoless children and not to the egotistic world.
I have reported to the administrator that you keep offending me and accusing me of lies, despite the fact that I gave you enough answers.
He is free to inquire whether you are actually the person you are claiming to be, i.e. Tharun Mitthal. He himself has been in contact with most of the PBKs from abroad when he was maintaining a website dedicated to AIVV and even after he left the AIVV. I don't think he must have ever come across a PBK named Tharun Mitthal from abroad.

Since anu refused to provide information related to the date/month/year when he/she as Tharun Mitthal had undergone bhatti at Kampil, I had written to Baba to check the record of all the persons from abroad who had undergone bhatti at Kampil to check whether any such person named Tharun Mitthal had attended bhatti and submitted any letter of faith as an Affidavit. I have received the following reply today:

जो भी विदेशियों की सूची हमारे पास है जिन्हों ने भटठी की है उसमें किसी थरुण मित्थल (Tharun Mitthal) नामक व्यक्ति का (Affidavit) नहीं है । यदि उसने कौनसे साल , महीने , तारीख में भटठी की थी इसकी डिटेल में जानकारी मिलेगी तो अच्छा रहेगा।

The approximate English translation of the above reply is as follows:
"There is no affidavit of person named Tharun Mitthal in the list of foreigners available with us, who have undergone bhatti. It would be nice if detailed information regarding the year, month, date when he did bhatti."

Now it is proved that the information regarding his/her identity that anu provided was not correct. If he/she wants to prove that he/she is right, he/she should provide the information regarding the date/month/year when he/she underwent bhatti.

OGS,
Arjun

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by pbkindiana » 09 May 2011

Anu wrote:
I have reported to the administrator that you keep offending me and accusing me of lies, despite the fact that I gave you enough answers.
Are you seeking for justice from the admin who calls others' idiots? The admin doesn't have any authority to give any judgement to the members of this forum.

indie.

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by ANU » 09 May 2011

arjun wrote:"There is no affidavit of person named Tharun Mitthal in the list of foreigners available with us, who have undergone bhatti. It would be nice if detailed information regarding the year, month, date when he did bhatti."
Why should my affidavit be among foreigners? Do AIVV push into foreign list those who temporarily live abroad, despite that fact they have Indian citizenship and when they did batti they lived in India? I have never changed my citizenship and left India temporarily for business reasons.

Arjun, you did your best to prove your bias and you false assumptions. You caused lots of harm and accused someone that you don't know very severly. You have some story in your mind and try to prove it and when you are not able to do it, you are trying desperately some other methods. You are ready to make an Indian citizen a resident of a foreign country.

I don't need to reveal to you any other facts apart from those I revealed. I think that even revealing those which I revelaed was too much as it becomes clear that you are using those data dishonestly. Moreover, you proved yourself to judge people by labels. I do not trust you and I do not trust AIVV. I am glad that I did not reveal anything more to you.

Apart from this, the procedure of checking and getting my data from the office, which you started, is totally against the rule of keeping all documents from children secret. As a member of AIVV you have no right to receive any data about the others unless they themselves give them to you. You undermine my credibility and accused me of lies. After all damage and accusation what I experienced from you in this forum, I consider you as a person working to hurt others who challenge AK on purpose

I, when I did batti and surrendered all my data to Baba, did not entitle anyone from the office to use my data or to reveal them to any other students. The fact that somehow you are allowed to other students data, proves how AIVV works. I do not whish to receive any more your comments based on your assumptions, your story about me which you created. Please, use your mind to elaborate more justification and false explanations of false stories which AIVV created and spread among students.

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by ANU » 09 May 2011

pbkindiana wrote:Are you seeking for justice from the admin who calls others' idiots? The admin doesn't have any authority to give any judgement to the members of this forum.
I am not seeking justice from him/her. I simple reported that arjun created hostile atmopshere around me and accused me of lies, becasue he doesn't like uncomfortable facts about AIVV which I presented.

Where and when did administrator call someone 'idiot'?

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by arjun » 10 May 2011

anu wrote:Why should my affidavit be among foreigners? Do AIVV push into foreign list those who temporarily live abroad, despite that fact they have Indian citizenship and when they did batti they lived in India? I have never changed my citizenship and left India temporarily for business reasons.
Your reply is exactly as I was expecting. When AIVV has sincerely made efforts to find out whether any person named Tharun Mitthal from abroad has done bhatti, you say that you were living in India. The more we are trying to seek the truth about your identity (which you have provided on your own) the more you are changing and hiding facts to prevent us from reaching the truth.

OK, if you don't have any foreign citizenship, please tell us which mini-Madhubans or Gitapathshala were you connected with when you did bhatti, because if someone comes for bhatti from India he has to give reference of the gitapathshala or mini-Madhubans with which he/she is connected.

The other day when I referred to your original statement that you were from Dubai you told that you keep travelling all over the world. If you are a citizen of India, I don't think you can continuously travel all over the world throughout the year without coming back to your original address in India. Anyway, your constant changing of facts about yourself confirms our doubt that you might be lying about your identity.
Arjun, you did your best to prove your bias and you false assumptions. You caused lots of harm and accused someone that you don't know very severly. You have some story in your mind and try to prove it and when you are not able to do it, you are trying desperately some other methods. You are ready to make an Indian citizen a resident of a foreign country.
I have not caused any harm to you. Whatever I am trying to know is based on the information that you provided voluntarily on this forum. I am just trying to confirm from AIVV the fact that you provided voluntarily on this forum.

If you are really an Indian citizen and underwent bhatti as an Indian citizen why are you so afraid about giving just the date/month/year of your bhatti. When you don't want anyone of us to object when you reveal personal details of Baba Virendra Dev Dixit with an intention to defame him, then why do you want to hide this small detail which will end all controversy.
I don't need to reveal to you any other facts apart from those I revealed. I think that even revealing those which I revelaed was too much as it becomes clear that you are using those data dishonestly. Moreover, you proved yourself to judge people by labels. I do not trust you and I do not trust AIVV. I am glad that I did not reveal anything more to you.
You revealed the information voluntarily and now just because you cannot defend that small bit of information you are accusing me of dishonesty. But even with this small information we can still find out whether any PBK from India named Tharun Mitthal has undergone bhatti. Just because of your obstinacy, the nimit sisters will have to spend some more time and energy in checking the facts. I don't think the number of PBKs who have undergone bhatti so far is more than a lakh, so, they can physically check their records to find out whether any person named Tharun Mitthal has undergone bhatti so far in the history of AIVV or not.

Many members (including shivsena Bhai, the Admin) have raised the issue of letters of faith as to why it is sought on Affidavits (Judicial Stamp Papers). Now we can practically see how people give letters of faith (even on Judicial stamp papers) and then refuse to accept the facts. Persons like Tharun Mitthal will only prompt Baba to make the rules stricter so that people do not lie in the Court of law.
Apart from this, the procedure of checking and getting my data from the office, which you started, is totally against the rule of keeping all documents from children secret. As a member of AIVV you have no right to receive any data about the others unless they themselves give them to you. You undermine my credibility and accused me of lies. After all damage and accusation what I experienced from you in this forum, I consider you as a person working to hurt others who challenge AK on purpose
OK, I may not have a right to receive any data about others from AIVV, but I do have a right to confirm facts that someone has provided voluntarily on a public forum.
Barack Obama has become the President of America. Yet his citizenship was a major controversy until he himself provided documentary evidence to prove his citizenship recently. So, I don't think confirming something that someone has provided voluntarily constitutes any violation of law.
I, when I did batti and surrendered all my data to Baba, did not entitle anyone from the office to use my data or to reveal them to any other students. The fact that somehow you are allowed to other students data, proves how AIVV works. I do not whish to receive any more your comments based on your assumptions, your story about me which you created. Please, use your mind to elaborate more justification and false explanations of false stories which AIVV created and spread among students.
AIVV is not revealing anything on its own. It is only trying to confirm whatever information you have provided so far voluntarily that you are Tharun Mitthal from Dubai. Please do not speak lies that I am commenting on assumptions. I have made all sincere efforts to confirm the information that you have provided voluntarily. Just because we are trying to find out the truth you want to stop us by repeatedly warning me that you have reported the matter to Admin. If you are true why do you fear any kind of investigation? Your hiding of facts only proves that you are on the wrong side.

OGS,
Arjun

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by arjun » 10 May 2011

I am not seeking justice from him/her. I simple reported that arjun created hostile atmopshere around me and accused me of lies, becasue he doesn't like uncomfortable facts about AIVV which I presented.
Please do not spread lies. I am not creating any hostile atmosphere. I am just trying to confirm the information that you have provided on a public forum voluntarily.

Secondly, we have not stopped you from presenting any uncomfortable facts about AIVV. You are free to present any fact. But at the same time you should be ready for cross-questioning. Otherwise, you will be liable to be accused of one-sided attacks on AIVV.

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by shivshakti » 11 May 2011

I have read some characteristics of peacock after reading this thread and also googled why Krishna wears a peacock feather. The gist of the reading was that peacock colors symbolize male romanticism, which is why in scriptures the gopikas fell for Krishna for having seen his colors(feathers spread out to attract).

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by shivsena » 11 May 2011

shivshakti wrote:I have read some characteristics of peacock after reading this thread and also googled why Krishna wears a peacock feather. The gist of the reading was that peacock colors symbolize male romanticism, which is why in scriptures the gopikas fell for Krishna for having seen his colors(feathers spread out to attract).
Dear brother shivshakti.
Welcome to the forum.

You are quite right about why Krishna wears the peacock flower....peacock is the only male of the animal species which attracts the females.....as a rule it is the female which is more beautiful than the male and attraction prerogative always rests with the female...but with peacock this is an exception....the peacock(male) attracts the peahen(female) for procreation and this is remembered in Bhaktimarg with Krishna adorning the peacock flower as a sign of mayavi attraction to establish the chandravanshi dynasty....all souls of chandra-vanshi dynasty will never leave the attraction for Krishna(baba dixit) and his advance knowledge.

The peacock flower has nothing to do with purity as is believed by BKs and PBKs.
shivsena.

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by shivshakti » 11 May 2011

Shivsena Bhai,

Thanks for welcoming me to the forum. I wanted to see if there can be any way to have a separate divison to non-BKs-non-PBKs, such that the views can be exchanged in a peaceful manner among the birds of the same feather instead of getting prone to the hostility of others who I see some level of intolerance towards your views. I have noticed that you state to the point and back it up with muralis. No beating around the bush. It will be a pure waste of time and energy for the ones who do not want to have an open ear to others views regardless of discriminating whether something said is right or wrong. Also, there are plenty of observers like me who would like to strike on the "bulls eye" instead of wasting time on "bull *******"(im sure there is a reason for using this word instead of cow *******).

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by shivshakti » 11 May 2011

Peacock is considered the national bird of India (probably Bharat). I would like to know what is the significance of national animal which is tiger.

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by ANU » 11 May 2011

shivsena wrote:as a rule it is the female which is more beautiful than the male and attraction prerogative always rests with the female...but with peacock this is an exception....
Probably it is only the human species where the male appearance is less attractive then female one. In the animal world, mammals, birds, fish, insects etc. usually the male has some features which make his appearance distinctive, colorful, attractive. The peacock seems to be the apogeum of this.

http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbvi ... g-fish.jpg

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_xWFKiPJDO_I/T ... 00/mfb.jpg

http://yhsbiology.wikispaces.com/file/v ... female.jpg


There are cultures in which the peacock is the symbol of fidelity, royalty, eternity, mercy. In many cultures the peacock is a symbol of vanity, empty pride and ego.

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by arjun » 12 May 2011

shivsena wrote:You are quite right about why Krishna wears the peacock flower....peacock is the only male of the animal species which attracts the females
Another example of how you jump to make use of others' statements to get support for your imaginary theories without verifying facts. There are ample examples where males in the animal species have special features to attract the females.

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Re: AK crazy story about peacock

Post by shivsena » 13 May 2011

ANU wrote:
There are cultures in which the peacock is the symbol of fidelity, royalty, eternity, mercy. In many cultures the peacock is a symbol of vanity, empty pride and ego.
Dear anu.
You are right about the peacock being symbol of empty pride and ego.
Just sharing a small paragraph i just read on the internet.


"Maa Saraswati is often accompanied by a peacock sitting on one side looking
at her in awe and admiration. This implies that true knowledge is respected
and admired by a peacock, an animal that prides in showing his beauty to the
world. Even the peacock is mesmerised by the power of pure knowledge. Maa
Saraswati teaches us to overcome this display of worldly beauty. She
sometimes sits on top of the peacock representing that wisdom suppresses
ego. Peacocks also change behaviour depending on the weather and therefore
can be unpredictable. Maa Saraswati prefers not to use the peacock as her
transport implying that we should not travel in life accompanied by
unpredictability and instability as those are hindrances in gaining divine
knowledge."
maa-saraswati.jpg
maa-saraswati.jpg (142.28 KiB) Viewed 3615 times
Maa-Saraswati2.jpg

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