Shankar's Part ?

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arjun
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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by arjun » 24 May 2013

shivsena wrote:Brahma so Vishnu is mentioned in Murlis...is Brahma so Shankar anytime mentioned in Murlis ????
It may not be mentioned 'Brahma so Shankar' but it is definitely mentioned that whomsoever I enter should be named as Brahma. Since Shiv enters in Shankar also, so Shankar happens to be a Brahma, too.

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by shivsena » 24 May 2013

arjun wrote:
It may not be mentioned 'Brahma so Shankar' but it is definitely mentioned that whomsoever I enter should be named as Brahma. Since Shiv enters in Shankar also, so Shankar happens to be a Brahma, too.
Is it mentioned in any Murli that Shiv enters Shankar ????

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by Roy » 24 May 2013

shivsena wrote:Is it mentioned in any Murli that Shiv enters Shankar ????
"There (at Amarnath, where the ice Shivalingam is situated in the Cave shrine), they show the picture of Shiv. Well, in whom is Shiv sitting? Shiv and Shankar are shown. Shiv sat in Shankar(Prajapita-Ram) and narrated the story (to Parvati or Sita - meaning His true children). This is the account(i.e. the eternal relationship of Shiv and Shankar in the Drama). This is completely wrong... (that) he sat on the mountain and narrated the story only to one Parvati, and only she went to the abode of eternity. It is so 100% wrong." [Mu 06.10.76]

“(Shiv)Baba has been to Amarnath as well. Baba saw everything as to how they make the Shivling (naturally in ice). They say that Shankar narrated a story to Parvati there. Well what kind of degradation did Parvati undergo that he sat and narrated the story to her? Actually, you all are Parvatis; you pass through the cycle of birth and death(i.e. pass through the cycle of faith and doubt in the Confluence Age)... and you are listening to the story(i.e the Advance Knowledge, narrated through Shankar) to achieve true salvation(liberation from ignorance and doubts).” [Mu 05.09.08]

"Shankar(Prajaita-Ram) is beyond the cycle of birth and death(i.e. he never loses faith in the Father, or in his part of becoming the true Narayan, once he has this realisation, in 1976)." [Mu 04.05.00]

"ShivBaba(Father Shiv) is subtle(incorporeal). Similarly Shankar(Prajapita-Ram) is also subtle(i.e. he attains the 100% soul conscious or incorporeal stage equal to Father Shiv's by the end of the Confluence Age... hence the name at practical Revelation, of Shiv Shankar Bholenath)." [Mu 29.09.77]

"Father had explained that Prajapita Brahma(Ram), who is a bodily being now(i.e. an effort maker soul)... he only becomes subtle(i.e. 100% incorporeal, like Father Shiv at the end, whilst remaining in his corporeal body - this is the complete angelic stage of Shankar - Brahma so Shankar)." [Mu 23.01.84]

"Angels means kings of the physical body." [Av 05.02.09]

"Prajapita Brahma (aka Shankar aka Ram) is very great, is not it? He is called next to God(the no 1 child or son)." [Mu 20.11.76]

"You have two servants. Highest among all, i.e. ShivBaba(Father shiv) and then Prajapita Brahma(Ram)." [Mu 02.06.05]

"Father has explained that Shankar (aka Prajapita-Ram) does not have so much of a role to play. He is next to Shiva." [Mu 08.03.76]


Each one can draw their own conclusions...

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by shivsena » 25 May 2013

Does Ram alias Shankar take varsa from shiv ????....if he takes varsa, then what is the varsa ????

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by Roy » 25 May 2013

shivsena wrote:Does Ram alias Shankar take varsa from shiv ????....if he takes varsa, then what is the varsa ????
It is my understanding, that our inheritance is the knowledge that Father Shiv narrates to us through Brahma... the knowledge that reveals to us how to make accurate efforts in order to become pure, and create the new world in the process. Ram receives the same inheritance as we do, but makes the greatest efforts based on his no 1 faith and understanding, and thus receives the greatest prize.

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by shivsena » 25 May 2013

Roy wrote: Ram receives the same inheritance as we do, but makes the greatest efforts based on his no 1 faith and understanding, and thus receives the greatest prize.
Do you mean to say that Ram-Virendra Dev Dixit-Shankar receives the same inheritance as other souls....and what is that inheritance ????...is it becoming devta ??

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by Roy » 26 May 2013

shivsena wrote:Do you mean to say that Ram-Virendra Dev Dixit-Shankar receives the same inheritance as other souls....and what is that inheritance ????...is it becoming devta ??
It is my understanding, that the direct inheritance we receive from God(Ram ShivBaba), is to ultimately become a deity(nar to Narayan, nari to Lakshmi) in this very birth in the new world(i.e. the practical Golden Age that begins in 2036/7)... But Ram(Virendra Dev Dixit) becomes the no 1 deity, World Emperor Narayan many years before this. Before we can achieve becoming a practical deity... i.e. when the body has also become pure after 2036/7; we first have to become jeevanmukt... i.e. an angel... and angel means king of the physical body(even in its degraded state), not the subtle body.

"Father is the creator of the Heaven(Ramraj), so he will surely give the inheritance of Heaven and will give it in hell only(i.e. Heaven will first of all be established in the Confluenced Age, and ruled by Lakshmi-Narayan, physical parents of Radhe-Krishna - as Heaven will exist in subtle form, some years before hell is finally destroyed by nuclear war, in 2036/7). [Mu 09.06.74]

"There is a difference between becoming a World Emperor(Confluence Aged Narayan aka Prajapita-Ram, ruling over 5-7 billion souls) and an Emperor of Satyug(i.e. Golden Aged Narayan aka Brahma Baba Krishna, ruling over 900,000 souls)." [Av 28.01.85]

"These Lakshmi & Narayan(i.e. Ram-Sita of the Confluence Age) are called God & Goddess. They got the inheritance from God (directly in the Confluence Age - not through deity parent in the Golden Age). [Mu 18.02.71]

"They (Confluence Age Ram-Sita) become Lakshmi & Narayan through this RajYoga, in this Purushottam Sangamyug only(i.e. in this very birth- not the next)." [Mu 05.12.74]


Once a subtle bodied soul becomes complete(i.e. achieves the constant seed stage... e.g. Brahma Baba Krishna at the end... Brahma so Vishnu), it loses it's subtle body, just as Father Shiv who is always incorporeal, has no subtle body. A subtle body indicates body consciousness or impurity to some extent, and this is why Dadi Gulzar loses her consciousness when Brahma Baba Krishna enters her; because Brahma Baba carries this remnant of his body consciousness with him, in the form of subtle physical energy, that exerts subtle pressure on the body of Dadi Gulzar when he enters her.

So we are all given the same knowledge by ShivBaba(Shiv+Brahma)... but Ram aka Shankar, is the soul who receives the no 1 inheritance, in as much as he becomes equal to the Father through his efforts(purusharth)... Only he achieves the completely incorporeal stage, equal to Father Shiv's.

"Whoever has more knowledge will get the higher post." [Mu 26.01.74]

"Those who become practical proof of knowledge and Yoga, only (they) will reveal the Father." [Mu 06.08.70]

"(Incorporeal)ShivBaba(i.e. Father Shiv) is subtle(i.e. His stage is always incorporeal, whether in the body or not). Similarly Shankar(Prajapita-Ram) is also subtle(i.e. he attains the 100% soul conscious or incorporeal stage equal to Father Shiv's by the end of the Confluence Age... hence the name at practical Revelation, of Shiv Shankar Bholenath)." [Mu 29.09.77]

"Father had explained that Prajapita Brahma(Ram), who is a bodily being now(i.e. an effort maker soul)... he only becomes subtle(100% incorporeal, like Father Shiv at the end, whilst remaining in his corporeal body - this is the angelic stage of Shankar)." [Mu 23.01.84]

"When Prajapita Brahma who is corporeal now (i.e. making spiritual efforts), becomes complete(100% soul conscious), destroys all his sins, then he becomes an angel(called Shankar - a King within his old degraded body)." [Mu 20.01.78]

"Prajapita Brahma is (always) here (on earth in corporeal form - never in a subtle body like Brahma Baba Krishna). You have divine visions. When the corporeal (Prajapita)Brahma(Ram) becomes pure(i.e. becomes a complete angel called Shankar), then the complete subtle(Avyakt) form is seen there(i.e. witnessed through physical eyes - a subtle body cannot be seen with physical eyes)." [Mu 02.04.77]

"Angels mean kings of the physical body." [Av 05.02.09]

"Even ghosts come and enter. However, that is a (human) soul, isn’t it (not the Supreme Soul)? When the ghost performs its task, then the part of that soul (in whose body the ghost has entered) comes to a halt.” [Mu 12.07.73]

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by shivsena » 13 Sep 2013

arjun wrote: Since Shiv enters in Shankar also, so Shankar happens to be a Brahma, too.
Mu:9-7-68: "Vishnu aur Shankar ko rath nahin banna padta."
According to the above point, supposed Shankar partdhari(-Virendra Dev Dixit) does not become rath-Chariot of Shiva....then why do PBKs insist that shiv enters Shankar(-Virendra Dev Dixit) and shiv is going to be revealed as Shankar.

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by Roy » 13 Sep 2013

shivsena wrote:Mu:9-7-68: "Vishnu aur Shankar ko rath nahin banna padta."
Dear Shivsena Bhai... i have gotten the gist of what you are saying, but would you be kind enough to give me a complete translation of the Murli point.

Many thanks

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by shivsena » 15 Sep 2013

Mu:9-7-68: "Vishnu aur Shankar ko rath nahin banna padta." ["Vishnu and Shankar do not become Chariot"]

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by Roy » 16 Sep 2013

shivsena wrote:Mu:9-7-68: "Vishnu aur Shankar ko rath nahin banna padta." ["Vishnu and Shankar do not become Chariot"]
Thank you Bhai!

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by Roy » 16 Sep 2013

"Vishnu and Shankar do not become (Father Shiv's) Chariot." [Mu 09.07.68]

This is an interesting point, and like other points needs to be considered in relation to other points on this subject. For example... we are told that Krishna Brahma Baba is Vishnu, or will become so at the end when he is complete... and yet we all agree that Father Shiv entered him... so by this reasoning, when Prajapita-Ram becomes the complete angel Shankar at the end, there will no longer be the need for Father Shiv to remain in the the corporeal world, because Heaven has been established on earth as Ram has now becomes equal to Him, and 4 other souls are in complete harmony with Ram who constitute the dual form of Vishnu who will sustain Vaikunth or Vishnupuri until final destruction.

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by arjun » 16 Sep 2013

I agree with the explanation given by Roy Bhai.

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by sita » 17 Sep 2013

"Vishnu and Shankar do not become (Father Shiv's) Chariot." [Mu 09.07.68]
I went through the 9.7.68 Murli but did not find this point. Shivsena, is it possible to give reference of where did you find this point?

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Re: Shankars Part?

Post by shivsena » 18 Sep 2013

sita wrote:
I went through the 9.7.68 Murli but did not find this point. Shivsena, is it possible to give reference of where did you find this point?
OK...i will search for the Murli and let you know.

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