Advice to Virendra Dev Dixit and AIVV members

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sachkhand
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Who is Hiranyakashyapu? Dada Lekharaj or Veerendradev Dixit.

Post by sachkhand » 01 Jan 2008

Aum Shanti.

It is said by Virendra Dev Dixit that Lekhraj Kirpalani accepted himself to be the Chariot of Supreme Soul Shiv. In other words accepted and said Shivoham and hence he enacted the part of demon Hiranyakashyapu. Virendra Dev Dixit has also explained the meaning of Hiranyakashyapu as the one who drinks or draws the golden vigour of others.

Now the question arises, whether is there any crime in accepting the Truth. GodFather (Parampita) Shiv Himself has declared openly that Lekhraj Kirpalani is His Chariot who has been renamed as Brahma and He, GodFather Shiv, gives Godly knowledge through Lekhraj Kirpalani And it is a fact that for about 18 years GodFather Shiv openly gave knowledge to all the interested children through Lekhraj Kirpalani Brahma. Suppose if President of India comes to some ordinary man's home and has a lunch. Is it a crime for that man in humbly accepting this fact. NO. Dada Lekharaj also did nothing else when he humbly accepted the fact that GodFather Shiv uses his body.

Can anyone say that Lekhraj Kirpalani after becoming Brahma, has anywhere anytime acted egoistically? Yes, he openly accepted the fact that he is Brahma and GodFather Shiv gives Godly Knowledge through him, but he never said that I (Lekhraj Kirpalani) am Shiv or that I am Supreme Soul (Paramatma). Lekhraj Kirpalani had the divine intoxication that he will be prince Krishna.

Next comes the act of drinking or drawing golden vigour out of others. Is there any B.K. of Lekhraj Kirpalani's time who says that Lekhraj Kirpalani's drishti or vision was vicious. Or has anyone said that Lekhraj Kirpalani used to instigate others to do his bodily worship by any kind. No. The only mistake I think he did was that he accetped to have Photo being taken with children and could not stop children from keeping his Photo. But in Murli classes children were advised of it's dangers. It was warned in Murlis that never remember Brahma as Lekhraj Kirpalani but remember GodFather shiv in BrahmaBaba. And it was a fact which GodFather Shiv had openly declared and even D.L. openly accepted.

So, What crime did Lekhraj Kirpalani do? How can Virendra Dev Dixit accuse Lekhraj Kirpalani as being Hiranyakashyapu? Is it because of jealousy or does Virendra Dev Dixit has any proof of wrong doings of Brahma Baba? Only Virendra Dev Dixit can answer.

Let us see what GodFather Shiv has said in Murlis.
  • ( Note: The Murli points are from the xerox copies of the original B.K. Murlis which are published in the book named 'Murli Khand-1'. The book is published by the Advance Party of Virendra Dev Dixit)

    1) Murli date: 27.1.99, on page number 161.
    "Human being calling himself God (Bhagawan) or Supreme Soul (Paramatma) this is totally wrong."

    2) Murli date: 8.9.68, on page number 152.
    (a) "Father himself is also called as Paramatma (Supreme Soul). His actual name is Shiv."
    (b) "Father has explained that one who call himself as Paramatma (Supreme Soul) has himself worshiped by others is a demon like Hiranyakashyapu."
Now apply these Murli points to Virendra Dev Dixit Here it is clearly and categorically stated that Father (i.e., GodFather or Parampita) is also called as Paramatma (Supreme Soul). But His actual name is Shiv. Which means that when we say Parampita-Paramatma together (i.e., GodFather-Supreme Soul) there are not two distinct souls, on the contrary The Soul Shiv is the only one called as Parampita (GodFather) and Paramatma (Supreme Soul). There is no ambiguity in this. But there are many cassettes and may be VCD's too where Virendra Dev Dixit has called his own soul as Paramatama (Supreme Soul) and has made quite efforts to prove it.

Virendra Dev Dixit has tried to establish himself as God but like a coward. He has no guts to accept openly what he is trying to prove since decades. There is no one in Advance Party who can publicly say that undoubtedly Supreme Soul Shiv has identified Himself in Virendra Dev Dixit But still Virendra Dev Dixit wants others to accept his ideas which he himself hesitates to accept.

Next, come to his actions. Virendra Dev Dixit. instigates girls and ladies to worship him bodily. He always draws attention of others towards his body. He instigates girls and ladies to have bodily contact with him. He draws sexual satisfaction and power through them in the name of making them pure. Is there any girl or lady in P.B.K.'s who can say it is difficult for her to forget Virendra Dev Dixit (as ShivBaba) and she is intoxicated by His (ShivBaba through Virendra Dev Dixit) Divine Love. Does her body language and mental state prove this. If no, then what kind of Gopis are these girls and ladies? And what kind of Sangamyugi Krishna is Virendra Dev Dixit.

If you do not know much about Gopis please read Bhagawat. It is written that the friend of Krishna who had great spiritual knowledge, when came to console Gopis of Vrindavan, as they were physically separated from Krishna, was surprised and enthralled on seeing and feeling the love Gops and Gopis had for Krishna. And here you have a lady who had even declared herself as wife of the so called Sangamyugi Krishna, Virendra Dev Dixit, the Supreme Soul, but has discarded her husband and lives with someone else. What kind of effect does she has even after having physical contacts with Virendra Dev Dixit and worshipping Virendra Dev Dixit?

I have drawn contrast between these two souls - Dada Lekharaj and Virendra Dev Dixit. Conclusion is left to you. You yourself decide who can be called Hiranyakashyapu.

Aum Shanti.
Sanjeev

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Post by andrey » 01 Jan 2008

Dear brother,
I believe that the meaning of Harnyakashap is not one who proves himself God, but one who says himself God, because one does not become God because he says so like you say I am Prajapita this is not enough. Also there is no evidence for someone proving himself as God. Even we children do not want to prove anything.

You will see that all the parties where there are separate Gods, in their followers there is no such enthusiasm that they have found God. Their efforts is mainly in politics to put someone up or down as you do. Similarly our desire is not to prove anything, but just to share whatever has made difference to us and present some new information someone may still be unaware for everyone to decide for himself.

If you take the example for Paramatma then this is new explanation. It is not explained in the Murli in such way, nevertheless the idea that amongst all the human souls there is one that is the highest seem acceptable. However it is also said that the biggest crime is to tell God omnipresent. For some this highest soul is Brahma Baba, some others claim that they are this highest soul. So who it is the one who says god omnipresent.

As regards the body language and mental state your claims resemble very much personal opinion with emotional charge deprived from examples and proves as are your claims that resemble rumors.

There are mothers who have never even seen Baba, still send letters of faith and because of being in bondage the example of Meera is used for them.

You should also supply proves from the advanced literature and cassettes, vcds based on which you state that Dada Lekradj is said to be Harnyakashap. Whilst we present Brahma as the big mother and motherly part and we also present the fatherly part, you prove both of them Harnyakashap.

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Post by arjun » 01 Jan 2008

sachkhand wrote:It is said by Veerendradev Dixit (Virendra Dev Dixit) that Dada Lekharaj (D.L.) accepted himself to be the Chariot of Supreme Soul Shiv. In other words accepted and said Shivoham and hence he enacted the part of demon Hiranyakashyapu. Virendra Dev Dixit has also explained the meaning of Hiranyakashyapu as the one who drinks or draws the golden vigour of others ... So, What crime did D.L. do? How can Virendra Dev Dixit accuse D.L. as being Hiranyakashyapu. Is it because of jealousy or does Virendra Dev Dixit has any proof of wrong doings of Brahma Baba. Only Virendra Dev Dixit can answer.
I don't remember any clarification Murli where ShivBaba (through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) has directly called Dada Lekhraj (Brahma Baba) as Hiranyakashyap. But yes, as you have said that Dada Lekhraj himself accepted that he was a Chariot of Shiv, that is why he performed the rehearsal of Krishna being considered as the God of Gita.

He generally refers to the ex-PBKs who have now been declared as Shiv or chariots of Shiv as Hiranyakashyap.

Baba Virendra Dev Dixit has no jealousy for Dada Lekhraj. You have interpreted the explanation of the word Hiranyakashyap by Baba Virendra Dev Dixit as a criticism of Dada Lekhraj, but that is only your interpretation. You have declared Baba Virendra Dev Dixit as being jealous of Dada Lekhraj, but you have not mentioned the innumerable number of VCDs where ShivBaba (through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) has praised Brahma Baba for having played the role of a mother (badee Maa) and being epitome of tolerance and love. He gave him the title of Yudhishtira because he remained sthir (stable) in the yudh (war). He did not leave the Yagya in the beginning just as his partner left the Yagya.
Next, come to his acts.Virendra Dev Dixit instigates girls and ladies to worship him bodily. He always draws attention of others towards his body. He instigates girls and ladies to have bodily contact with him. He draws sexual satisfaction and power through them in the name of making them pure. Is there any girl or lady in PBKs who can say it is difficult for her to forget Virendra Dev Dixit (as ShivBaba) and she is intoxicated by His (ShivBaba through Virendra Dev Dixit) Divine Love. Does her body language and mental state prove this. If no, then what kind of Gopis are these girls and ladies.
You are free to level charges against him just as some ex-PBKs under the leadership of Mr. Dashrath Patel did in 1998. Baba Virendra Dev Dixit has been exonerated of almost all the charges in the Court of law, except for one or two cases which have been dragging since the last ten years. Even after the 1998 incident, based on some frivolous complaints, Police have interviewed the surrendered sisters individually on a couple of occasions to ascertain whether these charges are true or not and whether they are staying there voluntarily or out of any compulsion. They did not get any negative report from anyone. If you have any complaint against Baba Virendra Dev Dixit you can very well lodge a complaint against him with the police.

Till now there are nearly 825 VCDs (video recordings of Clarification Murlis) and more than 400 discussion CDs (video recordings of discussions between Baba and PBKs) and whenever or wherever these CDs are recorded, it is guaranteed that every person sitting in the gathering (including the surrendered sisters) are captured/shown on camera. So, there is no question of hiding anyone.

There were hardly any surrendered sisters before 1998 and their numbers have been increasing steadily after that. Had the above charges been true, why would they prefer to live with a licentious man?

As regards your charges about the sisters not experiencing Baba's divine love, I would like to intimate that during my recent trip to my native place, I came to know of a surrendered PBK sister who did not shed any tear when told about the demise of her lokik Father and did not want to go home to meet her family although Baba permitted her to go home. There are many other cases of sisters who do not want to go to their lokik homes for treatment despite their illnesses. I also heard of another case where a surrendered sister refused to have meals for two days and when Baba visited that mini-Madhubans he himself fed that sister affectionately.

I heard from mothers living in mini-Madhubans how some siters would get cross with each other and Baba would talk and explain to them over phone like a mother. Of course there may also be some surrendered sisters who may not be happy with Sakar Baba but they are very few. Shivsena Bhai had mentioned about a few sisters having left the PBK Yagya a few months ago, but despite having left the Yagya, they do not hold any grudges against Baba and went back to their homes voluntarily.

With regards,
OGS,
Arjun

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Post by andrey » 01 Jan 2008

Dear brother,
Also the meaning you use for Harnyakashap - "the one who drinks the purity of others" - as far as i know is the meaning that has come in the advanced knowledge. So whilst in your speech you say something, in your actions you say something different. It is only Basmasur who tried to fight God with the boons that he used to have received from him only.

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Re: Who is Hiranyakashyapu? Dada Lekharaj or Veerendradev Di

Post by fluffy bunny » 02 Jan 2008

Hi sachkhand,

thank you for joining the forum and bringing up such important issues.
sachkhand wrote:Can anyone say that Lekhraj Kirpalani after becoming Brahma, has anywhere anytime acted egoistically? ... he never said that I (Lekhraj Kirpalani) am Shiv or that I am Supreme Soul (Paramatma).
Well, the version we have of Lekhraj Kirpalani according the BKWSU is neither complete nor true.

If you spend some time in the BKWSU History forum, we have published original documents from the Brahma-kumaris in the 1930s and 40s that prove that from 1932, when Lekhraj Kirpalani retired, to at least 1949, which is the latest date of original documents we have, Lekhraj Kirpalani called or considered himself to be Prajapati God Brahma and the Gita Inventor ... amongst other claims. These documents are also availabe via here for download.

There was mention or recognition of Shiva and a number of key facts have been falsified bringing into question the BKWSU's total version of history. Until they are willing to tell the truth, and the whole truth, and publish what evidence they have, we know nothing. Other contributors have also spoken about times when Lekhraj Kirpalani's son has spoken out and been suppressed by senior BKs about such matters as when Lekhraj Kirpalani left the Yagya to go and stay with his family for periods to be looked after, we have notice of time when he went a bit mad ...

I think in the beginning his ego was inflated and his handling of the legal matters was slippery as hell. I am not a PBK but, on evidence, I think he is still deluded and misguiding the BKWSU. Personally, I do not think he is the sanctified character the BKWSU try to portray him as. More later ...
Next, come to his actions. Veerendra Dev Dixit. instigates girls and ladies to worship him bodily. He always draws attention of others towards his body. He instigates girls and ladies to have bodily contact with him. He draws sexual satisfaction and power through them in the name of making them pure. Is there any girl or lady in PBKs who can say it is difficult for her to forget Veerendra Dev Dixit (as ShivBaba) and she is intoxicated by His (ShivBaba through Veerendra Dev Dixit) Divine Love. Does her body language and mental state prove this. If no, then what kind of Gopis are these girls and ladies? And what kind of Sangamyugi Krishna is Veerendra Dev Dixit. ... If you do not know much about Gopis please read Bhagawat.
The art and mythology of Krishna and Gopis is full of erotic imagery and emotions.

For those of us that know little of this aspect of the PBKs and Virendra Dev Dixit, would you please be specific in what you are talking about here?

We are not embarrassed about discussing sexual matters. We are mature, intelligent adults and we do not suffer the social stigmas BKs or even Indians do. We want the facts not allusions ... and given the position and influence of this forum in the BK world as the only independent voice committed to truth and the complete picture ... I think it is only fair that Virendra Dev Dixit and the PBK tradition are equally examined along with the BK one.

My understanding is that Virendra Dev Dixit had full sex with many female followers ... and by the account I heard satisfied them ... is this true or not? Were they ex-BK sisters or new to PBK? Was it consensual between the various parties? How was it organized? Its sounds to me like some tantric sexual rite. (The details I heard suggested that although the sisters were satisfied, he did not get any of them pregnant suggesting he did not come. This again underlines it was some sort of tantric practise).

I think we should know if this is true or not because it will go a long way to explaining why the BKWSU take such an offense against him. Does it still go on? How is it explained? The best 'official response' we get is something like "someone else potala is none of your business" ... well, frankly, that is not good enough. If it is tearing up the family, then we need to know.

To be absolutely honest, I have no problem with the idea, as long as it was consensual and there was no abuse. I can think of quite a few BK sisters that would be greatly improved by some good sex and, the bottomline is that if you are going to become a "spiritual master" then really you ought to know something about the realities of life. This is probably why "the mothers" are higher than "the virgins".

I think it is a great thing that at least a few Indian women are give some temporary happiness amidst their general life long misery. Sometimes it is necessary to break a taboo just to see how serious it actually was or was not.

So, please ... no more beating about the bush ... come straight to the point ... get the truth out, lay it on the table and then we can put it to rest.
1) Murli date: 27.1.99, on page number 161.
"Human being calling himself God (Bhagawan) or Supreme Soul (Paramatma) this is totally wrong."
You are taking the quote out of context.

I have a real problem with the way individual expect a single sentence, taken out of context, and apply it as an absolute truth for all time. Lekhraj Kirpalani was just talking about Saddhus or Gurus of his time claiming to be a god. Its also funny going back to the top of this page, because for 20 years or more, Lekhraj Kirpalani claimed or allowed the Brahma-kumaris to say he was Prajapati God Brahma, the Gita Inventor.

So who was Harnyakashap? Like Father, like son I say. Perhaps so called Shiva is a Harnyakashap.

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Post by sachkhand » 03 Jan 2008

andrey wrote:I believe that the meaning of Harnyakashap is not one who proves himself God, but one who says himself God, because one does not become God because he says so like you say I am Prajapita this is not enough. Also there is no evidence for someone proving himself as God. Even we children do not want to prove anything.
I think we should stand by what we say. If I say I am Prajapita, then it means I accept myself as Prajapita. I should have guts to say that my statement is True. It may not be possible for me to prove it. But when I say something to others and want others to accept my statement and want others to believe and have faith in my statement and lead their life accordingly, then it is my duty to stand by what I say. If you start doubting yourself, then you should not expect others to believe you and follow you. I have said that I had the thought very intensely to declare myself as Prajapita in the Forum. I have said that if my statement is True then Avyakt Vani of this season will be supportive of my statement by telling much about Prajapita. If nothing of that sort happens, then I have said that I will ask apology for making false statement.

I do not feel insulted in accepting Truth. After all what is the aim of my life. It is understanding Murlis correctly. Why? Because Murlis have the Godly Knowledge given by GodFather Himself. When GodFather Shiv has said that He has come to this world, I feel intensely that I should recognize Him. But how should I recognize GodFather Shiv, He does not has His own corporeal body. Obviously He will reveal Himself through someone's body. But GodFather Shiv has said in Murlis that He enters in many children's body. If the one giving Knowledge is not capable and the one receiving Knowledge has to be convinced or given proper Knowledge, then GodFather Shiv Himself enters in the person who is telling and gives Drishti or/and Knowledge to the receiving child.

Now the question aries, should the receiver who has felt the special attraction in the Drishti and feels that this knowledge is special, start following the orders of the person through whom he had received Drishti of GodFather Himself. I think there is only one corporeral body in this world through which GodFather Shiv will be revealed to the world as The Supreme Soul, and only through that body will come the True Gita Knowledge. GodFather Shiv will give the Godly inheritance of Mukti or/and JeevanMukti to all souls only through that body, and it is said that this personality is called as Prajapita Brahma. There might be many names given to this Personality in Bhakti cult (marg). But in Murlis GodFather Shiv has said that He gives Godly inheritance through Prajapita Brahma.

So, I am doing the Purusharth of recognizing this Personality "Prajapita Brahma" since many years. Since sometimes back I started having the thought that I am that personality or in other words "I am Prajapita Brahma". This sounds ridiculous. But since this thought used to come to me many a times, I wanted to get this thought out of my head. I wanted to have this thought tested. I did not want to live in world of fantasy.

So I put my thought in this forum with the topic "I am Prajapita Brahma". I stand by my statement, and if nothing comes out in the Avyakt Vanis of this season then I will ask apology for giving false statement. One thing I want to accept here is that after writing the topic "I am Prajapita Brahma" in the forum, after few days from then the thought has stopped coming to my mind.

I have gone off topic, sorry, but what I wanted to say is that please read the two points of the Murli dated 8.9.68 in the start of this topic. Here it is clearly stated that Father Himself whose actual name is Shiv is also called as Paramatma. And in the same Murli further it is stated that one who call himself Paramatma is a demon like Hiranyakashyapu. Now considering these two points can we not call Veerendradev Dixit as a demon like Hiranyakashyapu, because He has clearly stated in many of the cassettes that when we say Parampita-Paramatma, here Parampita is for Shiv and Paramatma is for the soul of Veerendradev Dixit.

When we first heard these cassettes we were astonished. But as we had a kind of respect and faith in Virendra Dev Dixit, we had the attitude of nodding our heads to whatever Virendra Dev Dixit says. But since couple of years I have personally started to churn the Knowledge i.e., Murlis and tally it with my experiences, and have started questioning things which I do not find proper. You are free to call me by names ( like Basmasur), I am least bothered.
andrey wrote:You should also supply proves from the advanced literature and cassettes, vcds based on which you state that Dada Lekradj is said to be Harnyakashap.
I do not remember whether Virendra Dev Dixit has directly called Dada Lekharaj as Hiranyakashyapu, but he has implied it indirectly. I cannot give you in which cassette or VCD, but there is proof in the literature of Advance Knowledge of Virendra Dev Dixit. Now, if I say fools can be called donkeys and in the same context I say you are a fool. Am I not calling you donkey? It may not be direct accusation, but it shows my views about you. I have just given you an example.

For Proof please read "Murli Khand-1" page number 138, where they have given subtitle SHIVOHAM under which they have given 6 Murli points. Here they have points which says about people saying shivoham, and the point that people calling themselves Paramatma are called Hiranyakashyap, and also given the Murli point where Dada Lekharaj is accepting ShivBaba's enterance in him and beside this point in brackets they have given (BrahmaBaba - SHIVOHAM). What should a reader understand from such remark. What do Virendra Dev Dixit and PBK's want to imply?
Arjun wrote:You are free to level charges against him just as some ex-PBKs
I, personally have no grudge against Virendra Dev Dixit. I have no plans to form any anti-party. I just want to recognize Prajapita Brahma and experience the love of Parampita-Paramatma Shiv. TIME IS RUNNING OUT OF HANDS. I have come to BK Knowledge in 1989-90. Still I am not able to surrender to my GodFather Shiv. How should I surrender? I first have to recognize Him. But in whom? In Prajapita. So, who is Prajapita? where is Prajapita? I am getting restless. I do'nt know whether you have experienced this restlessnes or not. I think of my lokik mother and my sister. They do Bhakti. I want to give them The Knowledge of Parampita-Paramatma Shiv. But how can I give when I myself do'nt know. Do anyone of you Know? Undoubtedly? If YES, then why are you not going public.

Hey Arjun and Andrey, tell me Truth, are you having bank account with lots of money in it, are you having property? Are you not interested in surrendering all that to GodFather's cause? Whomsoever you people believe as Prajapita Brahma, have you asked Him regarding this? If no, then you are just bluff masters. When you cannot just surrender your money and property to the GodFather, how can you surrender your body and mind to Him. And how can you surrender your sister, your mother and (if you are married) your wife to GodFather Shiv.
andrey wrote:There are mothers who have never even seen Baba, still send letters of faith and because of being in bondage the example of Meera is used for them.
You people talk about girls and ladies and mothers who have deep love for Virendra Dev Dixit as ShivBaba. It is very fine. I wish their belief comes out to be True. Let me be punished for my wrong deeds. It doesn't matter. But, in case it turns out to be false, then what? There are Gurus in India who have sexual relationship with many ladies. They do this citing the example of Sri Krishna and His Bhagawat. I am not against Bhagawat or Rasa Leela mentioned in it. But before saying anything further I would like to give few Murli points.

When I had gone to Kampil in 1993 and few times later, I had written Murli points topic wise from the registers provided to us for studying and copying. I am quoting from those points. For one point I don't have date, which I might have missed while writing or it might have not been there.
  • "Bharat has been totally defamed.------ So many queens were there. Made them elope. Stole butter. Had so many children. Actually this is all story of Prajapita Brahma. Have placed Krishna instead of Him." Murli date don't know.

    "There is connection of Gita with Bhagawat, and of Mahabharat with Gita." Murli date: 21.3.73.
Based on the above two Murli points I think first of all we should understand Prajapita Brahma clearly. Prajapita Brahma has to be declared first. I cannot understand why do the PBK's first take a letter duly signed by the newcomers to the Bhatti, which has in it that the undersigned person beleives and accepts Virendra Dev Dixit as prajapita Brahma. But the same Virendra Dev Dixit in VCD says that he has nowhere said or accepted that he is Prajapita Brahma. WOW. Has GodFather Shiv come to play trick on us.
  • Murli date: 27.5.85: "Who is Prajapita Brahma. Father sits and explains all this."

    Murli date: 19.1.01, Murli Khand page number 358. "The one teaching us is totally strange. He does not has this corporeal form. He is incorporeal. So see how wonderful part has been kept. How should Father teach? So Himself tells- I come in such and such body. In which body do I come, that is also told. People are confused- comes only in one body. But this is Drama, is'nt it. There cannot be change in this."
From the above two Murli points, I beleive that GodFather Shiv tells us and explains us directly who is Prajapita Brahma. And I think it is His prime duty. If GodFather Shiv cannot fulfil the above two Murli points, then it is His failure. Not mine or of any other children.
ex-I wrote:So who was Harnyakashap? Like Father, like son I say. Perhaps so called Shiva is a Harnyakashap.
Dear ex-l,

My humble advice to you is that you are wasting your time and energy in this forum. I think this forum, atleast Bk and PBK forum is for those who believe that there is a Supreme Soul who is our GodFather, and He has come to this world. If you do not believe in GodFather Shiv, then why waste your precious time here, making irrelevant comments?

Aum Shanti
Sanjeev.

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Post by arjun » 03 Jan 2008

what I wanted to say is that please read the two points of the Murli dated 8.9.68 in the start of this topic. Here it is clearly stated that Father Himself whose actual name is Shiv is also called as Paramatma. And in the same Murli further it is stated that one who call himself Paramatma is a demon like Hiranyakashyapu. Now considering these two points can we not call Veerendradev Dixit as a demon like Hiranyakashyapu, because He has clearly stated in many of the cassettes that when we say Parampita-Paramatma, here Parampita is for Shiv and Paramatma is for the soul of Veerendradev Dixit. When we first heard these cassettes we were astonished. But as we had a kind of respect and faith in Veerendradev Dixit, we had the attitude of nodding our heads to whatever Virendra Dev Dixit says.
Om Shanti. While giving the clarification of the Hindi words 'Parampita Parmatma', ShivBaba (through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) has said that 'Parampita' refers to the Supreme Father Shiv, who is the Father of all the souls (human, animals, birds, insects etc.) while 'Paramatma' refers to the Supreme Soul which means the one who is Supreme among the human souls, i.e. Prajapita. That does not mean that he is God.

And this explanation about 'paramatma' is only with reference to the phrase 'Parampita Parmatma' and it does not mean that in all the clarification Murlis whenever or wherever the word 'parmatma' is used it refers to Prajapita. Many a times, when the word 'Parmatma' is used as a single word it refers to God Shiv and not Prajapita.

Baba Virendra Dev Dixit has never said that he is the Supreme Soul, i.e. God. Neither has he accepted openly that he is Prajapita.
Hey Arjun ..., tell me Truth, are you having bank account with lots of money in it, are you having property. Are you not interested in surrendering all that to GodFather's cause. Whomsoever you people beleive as Prajapita Brahma, have you asked Him regarding this. If no, then you are just bluff masters.
Thanks a lot for this honour :D.
I cannot understand why do the PBK's first take a letter duly signed by the newcomers to the Bhatti, which has in it that the undersigned person beleives and accepts Veerendra Dev Dixit as Prajapita Brahma. But the same Veerendra Dev Dixit in VCD says that he has nowhere said or accepted that he is Prajapita Brahma.
As far as I know this is based on a Sakar Murli point which says that one should write in the nishchay patra (letter of faith) about the name of the Father if one has faith in him.
From the above two Murli points, I beleive that GodFather Shiv tells us and explains us directly who is Prajapita Brahma. And I think it is His prime duty. If GodFather Shiv cannot fulfil the above two Murli points, then it is His failure. Not mine or of any other children.
Suppose Shiv declares through you that Sanjiv Bhai is Prajapita Brahma, but how do we recognize that it is Shiv alone who is speaking through your body? cannot it be a human souls pretending to be God Shiv? And since we already have a person claiming to be Shiv himself or Chariot of Shiv writing on this forum from Russia, how do we know whether you are correct or he is correct? Similarly, many more persons may emerge claiming to be original God Shiv. Then how do we recognize the real one from the fake ones?

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Post by fluffy bunny » 03 Jan 2008

sachkhand wrote:Dear ex-l, My humble advice to you is that you are wasting your time and energy in this forum. I think this forum, at least BK and PBK forum is for those who believe that there is a Supreme Soul who is our God Father, and He has come to this world. If you do not believe in GodFather Shiv, then why waste your precious time here, making irrelevant comments?
For those who do not know the story, I made a rough outline of the classical story of Harnyakashap, here.

Sachkhand, my point was sincerely considered. Only by persistent study shall I discover the truth and I do not know yet if what we are dealing with in Shiva is a god, the god or whatever. No one knows. One can only have faith. Could he or they be what is understood as an Asura? A demi-god or even demon in English? Yes, of course. As you say, only time will tell.

The correct definition of "demon" is not necessarily Satanic, it just means disencarnate spirit. In modern English, we could be talking about a "higher being" or channelled entity. To be quite honest, my problem is the same as yours only differently expressed due to cultural influences. There are and have been so many in conclusions and deceits.

This is not a simple, benign 'God who is Truth' as was we have been led to believe. Other imperfect spirits are influencing.

But please forgive me and respond to the earlier part of my post. I want to know the whole truth of Virendra Dev Dixit too. I want there to be honesty and openness.

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Post by shivsena » 13 Jan 2008

arjun wrote:You are free to level charges against him just as some ex-PBKs under the leadership of Mr. Dashrath Patel did in 1998. Baba Veerendra Dev Dixit has been exonerated of almost all the charges in the Court of law, except for one or two cases which have been dragging since the last ten years.
Dear arjun Bhai.

What about the reverse cases of defamation that baba Virendra Dev Dixit had filed against Vishnu Party. Have they been taken back or they are still pending in court?

shivsena.

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Post by arjun » 13 Jan 2008

shivsena wrote:What about the reverse cases of defamation that Baba had filed against Vishnu Party. Have they been taken back or they are still pending in court.
I am not aware of these cases and will inform you if I come to know about their results.

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Post by pbktrinityshiva » 15 Jan 2008

Its ironic the same souls who through their own karma/fate accuse the Chariot of Virendra Dev Dixit, owe their existence to Ram's initial failure.

So for the child who turns away from his own Father whom he once embraced, how glaringly obvious is his inferiority when compared with the Father.

This thankfully is a beneficial drama.

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Ram becomes Ravan, Krishna becomes kans. Is it so?

Post by sachkhand » 24 Mar 2008

Aum Shanti.

The head of PBKs, Veerendradev Dixit, has said that Ram himself becomes Ravan and Krishna himself becomes kans in the drama. I am not able to understand his logic behind this statement. I accept that in the Murlis ShivBaba has said, and as is also explained in the picture of the Ladder (Seedhi ka chitra), that those who were Deities in Satyug themselves later become shudras. But the legendary Ram and Krishna are different aspects of the part played by The GodFather in Sangamyug (Confluence Age). How can Patit-Pawan Ram become or enact the part of Ravan, similiarly how can Gopi Vallabh Krishna become or enact the part of kans? On one hand Virendra Dev Dixit says that Jaisee drishti vaisee shrushti, in other words he says that children will grasp or perceive Godfather's part according to their mental state. So, the question that arises is, "has Virendra Dev Dixit himself perceived the role of Ram as Ravan and that of Krishna as kans when he says that Ram becomes Ravan and Krishna becomes kans?". If it is so then it means that he has misunderstood The GodFather.

Now, I would like to explain the logic why some people like Virendra Dev Dixit perceive Ram as becoming Ravan and Krishna as becoming Kans. To understand this logic, I request you to read my post "Some secrets of Krishna, Ram, Trinity and GOD." which is in the BK Splinter group.

In my post, I have explained how is GodFather i.e. the Gita Gyandata Trimurti Shiv Bhagwan, and who He is (read the last para of that post).

GodFather is present in this physical world now and is the next birth of Dada Lekhraj Brahma, and all the six units including Ram and Krishna together make The GodFather. The people like Virendra Dev Dixit who are not completely surrendered to the Ram and Krishna units of The GodFather, and when they mistakingly assume one or both of The Units Ram and Krishna to be their own higher self or selves then they instead of following Ram and Krishna Units, they try to control them or direct them according to their own incomplete or impure will. But, what happens when an egg hits a stone or darkness tries to cover Light. They themselves breakdown or vanish. They utterly fail. This failure makes them to think that the Unit Ram has become Ravan and Krishna has become kans, because they do not understand their own mistake but are doing what they are doing thinking that they have understood The GodFather.

The question arises, why cannot anyone else other than The GodFather, who is actually The next birth of Dada Lekharaj, assume the Units Ram and Krishna to be their higher self? The simple reason is that because it is not "The Truth". I will try to explain this with a crude physical example. Suppose if some organ or unit of someone's body like heart or liver is transplanted to someone else whose blood does not match with the donor's, then the organ or unit transplanted will react negatively with the receiver's body.

The same happens with the people assuming Ram and Krishna Units to be their own higher self because they are against Dada Lekharaj in some way or the other and have not accepted Him as Prajapita Brahma. Mind (like physical blood) of such people does not match the Mind (like physical blood) of The GodFather i.e., Dada Lekharaj's soul. This is the reason why ShivBaba has said in the Murli that "(God)Father is the highest Authority and then that Prajapita Brahma also stands to be the highest Authority. This Dada ( i.e., Dada Lekhraj) is the greatest Authority of all." (Murli dt. 8.1.95 page number 243 of Murli khand one published by PBKs).

(I am giving here information of how DNA changes with our feelings which was given in 'DNA REPORT by Greg Braden' which I had found in a website months back. This experiment was done by military. They took some leucocytes (white blood corpuscles) from a donor and studied the behaviour of the DNA of the donor in his body cells and the DNA in the leucocytes taken from his blood. They showed different video clips arousing different emotions in that donor. It was found that the DNA of the body cells of the donor and the DNA in the leucoytes taken out exhibited the identical response at the exact same time with no lag time or transmission time. They then tried how far do the emotions of that donor affect his detached DNA. They found that the donor's emotions affected his detached DNA even when taken 50 miles away from him. You can understand that subtle units of The GodFather are unimaginably many many times more sharp and active than physical DNA of human being).

Virendra Dev Dixit and PBKs are not the only people, but there are many BKs, even so-called Maharathis, who in their heart envy Dada Lekhraj. They do not have true love for him. Even I belittled Dada Lekhraj after coming to advance knowledge of PBKs. And before that, when I was in BKs, I saw how few BKs showed false and outward love for him. A thought had warned me once that I should not get against Dada Lekhraj. But unfortunately it happened after coming to PBKs. In a way it has helped me to understand the importance of Dada Lekhraj and has eventually led me to understand The GodFather.

Remember that ShivBaba has said in Murlis that when children teach RajYoga the world turns to hell and it is only when The GodFather teaches RajYoga that Heaven will be established. So, our first and the foremost thing to do is change our heart and have genuine true love for the soul of Dada Lekhraj, who is The Head and The Father of all human beings and whose practical Physical Personality is The GODFATHER.

Thanks.
Sanjeev.

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Re: Ram becomes Ravan, Krishna becomes kans. Is it so?

Post by arjun » 24 Mar 2008

Dear Sanjeev Bhai,

Om Shanti. Since this is the Commonroom Section, it would be better if you raise issues which are purely of interest to BKs/PBKs/ex-PBKs in the respective sections or in the BK-splinter groups section. Since most members of this forum are ex-BKs/newcomers, they may not be interested in such subjects.

In spite of being a PBK, it is not easy for me to completely understand your ideas, so I suppose it must be confusing for the ex-BKs/newcomers to understand the same.

Thanks for your cooperation.
Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

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Request to PBKs.

Post by sachkhand » 25 Mar 2008

Aum Shanti.

Dear PBKs. I have written a post in the commonroom by name "Ram becomes Ravan, Krishna becomes kans. Is it so?". I request you all to read it carefully, so that to understand GodFather. I hope it will be of use.

Thanks.
Sanjeev.

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Re: Request to PBKs.

Post by shivsena » 26 Mar 2008

sachkhand wrote:Dear PBKs. I have written a post in the commonroom by name "Ram becomes Ravan, Krishna becomes kans. Is it so?". I request you all to read it carefully, so that to understand GodFather. I hope it will be of use.
Dear sanjeev.
I have no interest whatsoever in reading any post which addresses Ramshivbaba as Ravan.
The very thought that Ram is considered as Ravan is so repulsive that i feel that my eternal spiritual Father is being defamed and i consider reading any such post as a waste of time and waste of energy.
So please excuse me.
shivsena.

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