GodFather Shiv's teaching is for the soul of Dada Lekhraj

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GodFather Shiv's teaching is for the soul of Dada Lekhraj

Post by sachkhand » 02 Jan 2008

Aum Shanti.

Virendra Dev Dixit has explained in the Advance Knowledge that GodFather Shiv while giving Godly Knowledge always says, 'YOU, YOU'. And that YOU is said to the person sitting in front. Virendra Dev Dixit has said that GodFather Shiv used to emerge a particular child and the actual student of this Godly Knowledge is that particular child.

But I have read few Murli points which indicates that Godly Knowledge in Murlis is not directed towards the soul of Virendra Dev Dixit but is meant for Lekhraj Kirpalani. Lekhraj Kirpalani is the actual student of GodFather Shiv who stands number one in the study of Godly Knowledge.

(Note: The Murli points are from the xerox copies of the original B.K. Murlis which are published in the book named 'Murli Khand-1'. The book is published by the Advance Party of Virendra Dev Dixit).
  • 1) Murli date 20.2.83, page number 125.
    (a) "Father Himself says I become Rider of this Chariot (body of Lekhraj Kirpalani). Give Knowledge to this one. Start from this one. Give 'Kalash' (Pitcher or Jug of Nectar of Knowledge) to mothers. This one (D.L.) is also considered mother, is'nt it. Firstly this one becomes afterwards you. In this one it is He (GodFather Shiv) sitting. But in front of whom should I tell. Then (I) sit and talk with souls."
    (b) "As soul stays between the eyebrows similiarly Baba also says (I) take little space beside soul and sit. Sit becoming Rider (of the Chariot i.e., body) and give Knowledge to this one."

    2) Murli date 27.6.86, page number 121.
    " Souls have been calling Baba Baba. Now you know we souls are also point, Baba is also point. Baba is ocean of Knowledge, ocean of Happiness. He gives us boon (Vardan), sits besides this one. Preceptor (guru) makes his student (shishya) sit beside him and teaches. This one is also sitting besides."
Here you can see that GodFather has given the example that as a preceptor makes his student sit beside him and teaches to him similiarly soul of D.L. is sitting besides GodFather Shiv as His Student.

You can also see that GodFather Shiv has said that He becomes Rider of the Chariot (body) of Lekhraj Kirpalani and give Knowledge to him, but as a single person talking does not look nice, He (GodFather Shiv) talks with souls sitting in front of Him. GodFather Shiv has also said that He starts giving Knowledge first from Lekhraj Kirpalani. He (GodFather Shiv) first gives Gyan-Kalash (Pitcher of Nectar of Knowledge) to Lekhraj Kirpalani Brahma who is also the Mother of all.

So, I think it is crystal clear that the number one student of The Supreme Teacher GodFather Shiv is the soul of Dada Lekhraj.

Aum Shanti.
Sanjeev.

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Post by andrey » 02 Jan 2008

Dear brother,
There is no doubt that the soul of Dada Lekradj hears first because he is there in the body. This statement is made based on another point from the Murli where it is said that "i speak to you and this one (Brahma) listens in between." There is also difference between listening and understanding.

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Virendra Dev Dixit might be failed Tretayugi Ram but not Ram ShivBaba.

Post by sachkhand » 03 Jan 2008

Aum Shanti.

Lots of confusion has been created by Virendra Dev Dixit and PBKs regarding Ram.

There is only one Soul in the whole universe which does not have It's own physical form. Only GodFather Shiv does not have His own Physical or Subtle Personality. All other souls have physical and/or subtle form. GodFather Shiv has said that only His Soul is called by name, all other souls are called by the name of their physical or subtle personality.

Then, what is the name of The Soul of GodFather? GodFather Himself has said that His name is Shiv. But He has said that although He, The Supreme Soul, is called upon by many names in this world His actual name is Shiv. I have come across few names in the Murlis like Somanath, Amarnath, Babulnath, Ram, Rudra, Bholenath.
  • Murli date 8.1.85: " You are on Ram's Shrimat. Call Ram call Shiv, have kept many names."
Here it is clearly stated that GodFather Supreme Soul Shiv Himself is also called as Ram. Now the question is that are we giving this name Ram to a physical personality or calling The Soul by that name. Please notice the difference. When we call upon GodFather Supreme Soul, we directly call Him by name like Shiv, Ram, Rudra, Somanath, Babulnath, etc., But when we call upon any human soul we say soul of Rajesh, soul of Harry, soul of Kamala, soul of Susan, etc.. Although body may be of either sex when we identify any other soul we consider or identify the physical or subtle personality first and then through that personality we identify the soul.

You may argue that GodFather Supreme Soul when is in Paramdham then He is called by name Shiv, but all other names are given only after He enters into a Physical or Corporeal form. GodFather Supreme Soul Shiv meaning Auspicious is His quality. He is in action or not in action, He is Auspicious i.e., SHIV. And all other names says about His Divine Deeds. O.K.

So with the name Ram is associated the Divine Deed of Patit-Pavan i.e., making impure into Pure ones and the Divine Deed of Sadgatidata i.e., giving Mukti or/and Jeevanmukti to all. O.K.

But is GodFather Supreme Soul Himself capable of doing these Divine Deeds or does He need help of other soul/souls for His work. Obviously , as He does not have His own body, He needs body/bodies of some human soul/souls. Is that enough or does He require certain quality in the helping soul/souls. Obviously, the soul/souls of those human beings should have the quality of co-operation with The GodFather Supreme Soul Shiv inorder to complete His Divine Work. 100% co-operation is possible only when there is 100% surrendering of their body, mind and intellect. This is the test based on which we get marks in all the four subjects namely Gyan, Yoga, Dharna, Seva.

The soul who has 100% surrendered his/her body, mind and intellect will attain 100% knowledge (i.e.,Trikaaldarshi), will be in 100% rememberance of The GodFather Shiv, will 100% imbibe all the Divine powers and qualities of GodFather Shiv and as a result serve humanity and this world 100%. Now of all the Human beings there will be only One who will do best amongst all Godly students.And GodFather Supreme Soul Shiv will select this One as His Chariot to play the part of Patit-Pavan, Sadgatidata Ram. O.K. This Personality will become The Embodiment of The Incorporeal GodFather Supreme Soul Soul Shiv. He can be called as Ram ShivBaba. O.K.
  • Murli date 20.2.83: "At present you souls follow the Shrimat of Shri Shri Ram ShivBaba."
But you know that when the above Murli point was being spoken at that time all Brahmakumar/ Kumaris used to follow the direction given through BrahmaBaba. It means that his personality is Ram-ShivBaba.

You may argue that the Divne Deed of Patit-Pavan and Sadgatidata was not completed then or was not at all done, and that the above Murli point refers to a future personality. O.K. Who is this personality?

Now, at this juncture Virendra Dev Dixit says that the soul of some children who had left Yagya in the beginning will come again in the Yagya. The soul of Tretayugi Ram who had failed earlier, who is the soul of Virendra Dev Dixit in the previous birth, will do purusharth as Virendra Dev Dixit at present and stand first.

Now it is said in Murlis that Sangamyug or Prushottam Sangamyug is the period to create our destiny for the whole Kalpa. This is not the period of taking service from others but to serve others. One who best serves humanity according to Shrimat will create best destiny for himself/ herself in Satyug and Tretayug and based on these two yugas will be the destiny of dwapuryug and Kaliyug. So Purushottam Sangamyug is not the period of experiencing worldly pleasures, but the period of experiencing Divine Bliss in rememberance of GodFather Shiv and doing service of Humanity according to Shrimat. The characters of GodFather depicted as Ram, Krishna, Mahadev in Hindu religious literature are different aspects of the parts played by GodFather and His children in Purushottam Sangamyug which did highest possible service to Humanity.

What is the result of this? Kaliyug changes into Satyug and the children create numberwise destiny for themselves in Satyug and Tretayug. GodFather Supreme Soul Shiv is the only one who does Nishkam Karma because He do not have His own physical body. All other human souls based on their Purusharth in Purushottam Sangamyug will create numberwise destiny for themselves for rest of the Kalpa.

Now let us see what is the destiny of the human soul Ram (which according to Virendra Dev Dixit is himself).
  • Murli date 21.5.73: "Ram also has to become servant of Lakshmi Narayan. Because Lakshmi Narayan passed fully. He failed. Therefore he is called kshatriya."

    Murli date: 29.7.73: "when there is Suryavanshi kingdom then Ram-Sita have to remain servant-maid. Afterwards when there is kingdom of Chandravanshi, then they take their kingdom."
The question which arises is that if the soul of Virendra Dev Dixit, as per his statements, does highest service of Humanity by completely surrendering himself to GodFather Shiv, then how is it that he has such a low destiny in the whole Satyug and has to wait till Tretayug to attain the status of kingship. It is out of my understanding.

Take for example, if a student studies hard in his school, he will get good marks. Vice-Versa, if a student gets low marks it means he has not studied well. Examiner of these schools may become corrupt and give good marks to a dull student or purposely give low marks to a hard working student. But in Purushottam Sangamyug our Teacher and Examiner is GodFather Himself. So there is no chance of corruption. What we Sow, so will we Reap.

Aum Shanti.
Sanjeev.

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Post by arjun » 03 Jan 2008

sachkhand wrote:Now let us see what is the destiny of the human soul Ram (which according to Virendra Dev Dixit is himself). Murli date 21.5.73: "Ram also has to become servant of Lakshmi Narayan. Because Lakshmi Narayan passed fully. He failed. Therefore he is called kshatriya." Murli date: 29.7.73: "when there is Suryavanshi kingdom then Ram-Sita have to remain servant-maid. Afterwards when there is kingdom of Chandravanshi, then they take their kingdom." The question which arises is that if the soul of Veerendra Dev Dixit, as per his statements, does highest service of Humanity by completely surrendering himself to GodFather Shiv, then how is it that he has such a low destiny in the whole Satyug and has to wait till Tretayug to attain the status of kingship. It is out of my understanding.
Dear brother,

Om Shanti. When you say that you have not realized your own part so far whether you are Prajapita or not. Few months ago you said you felt like being Prajapita and now you write that you don't get such thoughts. So, how can you declare others as Silver-Aged Ram? Moreover Baba Virendra Dev Dixit has not claimed to be Ram himself.
Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

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Post by arjun » 03 Jan 2008

sachkhand wrote:So, I think it is crystal clear that the number one student of The Supreme Teacher GodFather Shiv is the soul of Dada Lekhraj.
Had the soul of Dada Lekhraj been the no. 1 student of God Father Shiv, he should have played an allround part. While most Brahmin souls (including BKs and PBKs) believe that he has not taken birth after leaving his body in 1969 and PBKs believe that his role has been reduced in this Drama by more than 50 years because of lack of a corporeal body.

But if you believe that Dada Lekhraj's soul has taken rebirth, and if you declare yourself to be Prajapita, then you should also declare yourself to be the soul of Dada Lekhraj because Murlis say that Prajapita Brahma is No.1 and you have also declared Dada Lekhraj to be No.1.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

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Post by sachkhand » 07 Jan 2008

arjun wrote: But if you believe that Dada Lekhraj's soul has taken rebirth, and if you declare yourself to be Prajapita, then you should also declare yourself to be the soul of Dada Lekhraj because Murlis say that Prajapita Brahma is No.1 and you have also declared Dada Lekhraj to be No.1.
Aum Shanti.
I accept what you say. I had the feeling since more than a year. I am not 100% sure still and also I cannot prove it.

Aum Shanti.
Sanjeev.

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Re:

Post by sachkhand » 24 Mar 2008

arjun wrote: But if you believe that Dada Lekhraj's soul has taken rebirth, and if you declare yourself to be Prajapita, then you should also declare yourself to be the soul of Dada Lekhraj because Murlis say that Prajapita Brahma is No.1 and you have also declared Dada Lekhraj to be No.1.
sachkhand wrote: Aum Shanti.I accept what you say. I had the feeling since more than a year. I am not 100% sure still and also I cannot prove it.
Aum Shanti.

I take back my above words, because it is wrong on my part to make such a claim without myself being 100% sure about it. Sorry. :oops:

Thanks.
Sanjeev

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Re:

Post by mbbhat » 27 Jul 2008

arjun wrote:Had the soul of Dada Lekhraj been the no. 1 student of God Father Shiv, he should have played an allround part. While most Brahmin souls (including BKs and PBKs) believe that he has not taken birth after leaving his body in 1969 and PBKs believe that his role has been reduced in this Drama by more than 50 years because of lack of a corporeal body.
Dear Arjun soul,

What is the criteria for alround part?

I think, aim of life is to burn sins of 63 births and go to Paramdham without punishment. It is not to play just ALROUND PART in a physical body.

Physically ALROUND PART is IMPOSSIBLE. All sleep for nearly 8 hours everyday. Don’t you think that is waste?

You say that in the end, all the 600 crore people will recognize or get convinced Virendra Dev Dixit as Prajapita and accept him as Vishwa Maharajan (World Emperor) ... How it is going to happen? Will all the souls get chance to meet Virendra Dev Dixit personally and get convinced that he is No. 1 PURE SOUL?

You mentioned there is loss of about 50 years of Confluence Age for Brahma Baba. Now, was not there a loss of Conflunece Age for Sevakram? *You also say that anybody can do purusharthah and come in Rudramala. For example, say there is an agyaani soul whose present age is 70 years. Then it is sure that he was not in Gyan even in the beginning of Yagya. Does not your theory of loss of Confluence Age apply to such souls?

Is all round part done through body (actions) or thoughts? To do powerful thought you need purity, knowledge and time. Brahma Baba has all these and he gets even more time since he need not sleep.

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Re: Re:

Post by fluffy bunny » 27 Jul 2008

mbbhat wrote:You mentioned there is loss of about 50 years of Confluence Age for Brahma Baba. Now, was not there a loss of Conflunece Age for Sevakram?
I think we are straying a little far from the title of this topic which suggests that the Murli teachings are for the soul of Lekhraj Kirpalani, implicit in which is the framing of the PBK concept that the Murli teachings are primarily for the "appointed Chariot" which they consider to be the bodies and soul of Virendra Dev Dixit, that when the god of the Murlis say "you are ... etc" he is only speaking to that one, which ever one it is, with surety. (Correct me if I am wrong).

Having said that, I agree with mbbhat here that there was an apparently loss for the soul of Narain Shewakram (Sevakram) if that soul also incarnated as Virendra Dev Dixit later. How old was Virendra Dev Dixit when he took The Knowledge or accepted his part?

I have often struggled and found frustrating the translations of the "permanent Chariot" ... when, obviously, he was not permanent. Even the alternative translation "appointed" is difficult because was Lekhraj Kirpalani not "appointed" too? It is not very well defined or expressed. We have little factual information about the 'cult of Lekhraj Kirpalani' and little more about the 'cult of Virendra Dev Dixit', by which I mean the imagined and exaggerated divinity of each one (not to deny any real or manifest divinity that they might have).

Back to the question, yes, it would appear that the Murlis are best read as metaphorical and spoken for NOT all BK followers and it is a fault of the current BK system, a falsehood, that all and any follower is encouraged to believe that they are. No amount of mental gymnastics can make them work in their entirety, but that is generally always true of channelled messages from spirits or spirit realms. It takes a great deal of intuition and a fine intellect to divine what means what and what applies where.

And, my feeling is that "those that know, say little and those that don't say a lot". That so much Murli talk makes no more sense that the chattering of monkeys that sitting around Hindu temples hoping to be fed by genuine pilgrims. Each monkey troop might have its own alpha male and its own dominant females ... but they are still monkeys at the end of the day. I could even suggest this is why the god of the Murlis uses such metaphorical language as often referring to Hanuman's and monkey armies. Monkey intellects.

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Re: GodFather Shiv's teaching is for the soul of Dada Lekhraj

Post by arjun » 28 Jul 2008

mbbhat wrote:What is the criteria for alround part?
The hero actor of this drama should at least be physically present throughout the world drama. Allround part does not mean that he will not sleep or that he will be in Gyan throughout the 100 years age. But the actor should at least be present on the world stage.

One may argue that just as Dada Lekhraj's physical part was reduced by nearly 50 years from this world drama, the soul of Confluence-Aged Ram (Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) was not in Gyan for some years (1942-1969) during the Confluence Age and hence he too cannot be allrounder. But considering that the Confluence Age is of 100 years duration, a single soul cannot remain in Gyan throughout the Confluence Age unless it is born to Gyani parents in 1936 and lives upto 2036. So, this is not the criterion. The soul of the hero actor should be physically present throughout the Confluence Age, even if it is in the form of two births.

But simply remaining physically present in the Confluence Age is not the only criterion. He should also play a part worthy of a hero actor, proving himself to be greater than all other actors in thoughts, words and actions.
mbbhat wrote:You say that in the end, all the 600 crore people will recognize or get convinced Veerendra Dev Dixit as Prajapita and accept him as Vishwa Maharajan (World Emperor) ... How it is going to happen? Will all the souls get chance to meet Veerendra Dev Dixit personally and get convinced that he is No. 1 PURE SOUL?
No everyone will not meet ShivBaba through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit personally. Some may meet in person, some may see him on TV, some may get to know about him through media (print & electronic) and some through the word of the mouth. But everyone would accept that God Father has come and that the soul of Confluence-Aged Ram is the Father of humanity. He will not be revealed in the costume of Narayan as visualized by BKs. He will be revealed in an ordinary form, but just as people used to have visions of deities through Brahma Baba, similarly people will have visions of deities through him. Of course this is the belief of PBKs and it will be proved only when it actually happens.
ex-l wrote:How old was Veerendra Dev Dixit when he took The Knowledge or accepted his part?
In the present birth he was about 27 years old when he became a BK in 1969 and around 34 years old when he was recognized by some BKs as the new corporeal medium of Shiva in 1976.
mbbhat wrote:*You also say that anybody can do purusharthah and come in Rudramala. For example, say there is an agyaani soul whose present age is 70 years. Then it is sure that he was not in Gyan even in the beginning of Yagya. Does not your theory of loss of Confluence Age apply to such souls?
This question has been raised several times in the discussion CDs by PBKs. It has been said by ShivBaba (through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) that all those who are becoming PBKs now had received Godly message (mostly in Sindh Pakistan) in the beginning of the Yagya. So, some PBKs, who are more than 70 years old and were born in other parts of India ask how they could have been in the Yagya or received message in the beginning of the Yagya. For this Baba replied that such souls may have been with the hero actor, i.e. the soul of Ram in their previous birth, i.e. before 1936.
mbbhat wrote:Is all round part done through body (actions) or thoughts? To do powerful thought you need purity, knowledge and time. Brahma Baba has all these and he gets even more time since he need not sleep.
I have already written that apart from being physically present, the allround part should be reflected through elevated thoughts, words and actions. How can the world accept Brahma Baba to be no.1 pure soul when he is not physically present? By the way day and night is only for souls with bodies and not those without bodies. Baba says in the Murlis that you should remember Him even in the sleep. When Brahma Baba does not have a physical body itself then how will one believe if you say that he is creating powerful thoughts 24 hours a day?

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Re: GodFather Shiv's teaching is for the soul of Dada Lekhraj

Post by new knowledge » 28 Jul 2008

Arjun Bhai, who is the Base Soul of Aadi Sanaatan Deity religion according to you? - Lekhraj Kirpalani? Now, Aadi Sanaatan Deity religion is believed to be eternal, i.e, Avinaashee, which exists during the whole Cycle of Drama; then how is it possible that the part of the Base Soul (Lekhraj Kirpalani) of such eternal religion is reduced to more that 50% of the Confluence Age Drama?

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Re: GodFather Shiv's teaching is for the soul of Dada Lekhraj

Post by mbbhat » 29 Jul 2008

Dear Arjun soul,
Arjun wrote:No everyone will not meet ShivBaba through Baba Veerendra Dev Dixit personally. Some may meet in person, some may see him on TV, some may get to know about him through media (print & electronic) and some through the word of the mouth. But everyone would accept that God Father has come and that the soul of Confluence-Aged Ram is the Father of humanity. He will not be revealed in the costume of Narayan as visualized by BKs. He will be revealed in an ordinary form, but just as people used to have visions of deities through Brahma Baba, similarly people will have visions of deities through him. Of course this is the belief of PBKs and it will be proved only when it actually happens.
*So, you believe in saakshaatkaar (vision)?

*Another thing, I have heard from a PBK that Brahma Baba becomes dharmaraj in the end. Is BrahmaBaba going to get punishment at the end according to PBK philosophy?

*Your explanation that just by having company of Virendra Dev Dixit in previous births, one can come in mala does not seem to be OK. But I am not questioning it. Let readers judge themselves.

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Re: GodFather Shiv's teaching is for the soul of Dada Lekhraj

Post by arjun » 29 Jul 2008

mbbhat wrote:*So, you believe in saakshaatkaar (vision)?
Yes, definitely. Visions are caused in the path of worship (in almost all the religions), visions are caused in BK family and visions are caused in PBK family also. Although some PBKs are reported to have visions, but such incidents are very rare. But their frequency will increase as the time nears.
*Another thing- I have heard from a PBK that Brahma Baba becomes dharmaraj in the end. Is Brahma Baba going to get punishment at the end according to PBK philosophy?
Yes, Brahma Baba plays the role of Dharmaraj. I don't think he will get any punishment in the end. Even if there is any slight karmic account left over he can settle those accounts by entering in others' bodies.
*Your explanation that just by having company of Veerendra Diksit in previous births, one can come in mala does not seem to be OK. But I am not questioning it. Let readers judge themselves.
I don't know how you have drawn this conclusion from my statement. Anyways, just having lived in the company of the soul of Ram in the previous birth (in case of those PBKs who were born prior to 1936) is not the criterion for becoming a bead of the Rudramala. Efforts are definitely required to be made in the Brahmin life by any soul whether BK or PBK.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

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Re: GodFather Shiv's teaching is for the soul of Dada Lekhraj

Post by mbbhat » 05 Aug 2008

Dear Arjun soul,

Baba has said in Murli that except 8 (or 108 souls), all get punishment. According to you, the first 4.5 lakh souls are PBKs. Brahma and Mama are next to them. Then how do you say that Brahma baba does not get punishment? Is Mama's status almost equal to Brahma?

Baba says Dharmaraj is his right hand. So don't you think that he is the closest one to Shiva?

I think PBKs agree that 'if a person of 70 years age at present does strong effort, he can come in rudramala'. Then my question is/was a person who has lost 70 years of Confluence Age, has the chance to enter into rudramala (according to PBK philosophy). Then why do you say Brahma baba lost the place of hero actor just by not having physical body for 50 years of Confluence Age? The other person has no Gyan at all for 70 years!

PBKs also say that Brahma Baba and Virendra Diksit will be together in every birth. So, then why there is gap of so much between them? [Virendra Dev Dixit = number one soul and Brahma Baba = No. 450,001].

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Re: GodFather Shiv's teaching is for the soul of Dada Lekhraj

Post by button slammer » 07 Aug 2008

mbbhat**I think PBKs agree that 'if a person of 70 years age at present does strong effort, he can come in rudramala'. Then my question is/was a person who has lost 70 years of Confluence Age, has the chance to enter into rudramala(according to PBK philosophy). Then why do you say Brahma Baba lost the place of hero actor just by not having physical body for 50 years of Confluence Age? The other person has no Gyan at all for 70 years!
7 days of understanding can be equivalent to 70 years of misunderstanding.

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