Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

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shivsena
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Defamation of Father and Who is defaming whom ??

Post by shivsena » 18 Jul 2010

Defamation of Father and Who is defaming whom ????
What is meant by defamation of Father ????....and which Father is being defamed ???...is it Shiv or Ram !!!...and who is defaming the Father !!!

The above words are frequently used by BKs and PBKs to allege others without really knowing the meaning of the words.

First of all, it has to be ascertained which Father is being defamed....is it nirakar bindi shiv !!!....or is it the Chariot prajapita (Krishna--DL according to BKs and Ram--VD according to PBKs.).
Shiv jyoti bindu is accepted as nirakar Incorporeal Father in all the Three Worlds and in all the religions and so there is no question of defamation of shiv by any soul in all the Three Worlds.
BKs allege that PBKs are defaming the Father, but they do not clarify which Father PBKs are defaming.(as both believe in nirakar bindu shiv)....PBKs allege that BKs and ex-PBKs are defaming the Father, but again they do not clarify which Father is being defamed.

So is Father of humanity ie. Prajapita brahma being defamed !!!!....then the question arises who is defaming prajapita Brahma?
Since prajapita brahma is not known to the outside world, there is no question of the outside world defaming the Father.
Krishna--DL is known as prajapita brahma in the bk world and Ram--VD is known as prajapita brahma in the pbk world. So which world is defaming the Father as both are fighting to establish their own chariots as prajapita brahma.

So the billion dollar question remains unanswered: which Father is being defamed and who is defaming the Father.... each group pointing a finger at the other group without really understanding what is meant by defamation of Father.

Can all BKs and PBKs please give their valuable views on this controversial topic for a better understanding.

shivsena.

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by shivsena » 07 Jan 2011

To all pbk brothers,

It is said in Murlis : "Nischay-buddhi ( preet-buddhi) vijayanti and anischay-buddhi (vipreet-buddhi) vinashanti."
Murli dated 13-4-85 says: "children who vote for ShivBaba are preet buddhi and those who vote for Krishna are vipreet-buddhi."

In the above points Shiva is comparing the two groups of children.
Who are these two groups ??

BKs would interpret this point as: BKs are preet-buddhi(as they believe in bindi ShivBaba is God of Gita) and the outside world is vipreet-buddhi.(as they believe Krishna is God of Gita)

PBKs would interpret this point as: PBKs are preet-buddhi (as they believe that Shiva is narrating Gita through the present Chariot VD ) and BKs are vipreet buddhi (as they believe that Shiva narrated Gita through Krishna DL)

But i feel that Shiva is talking about those who vote for personified yartharth roop of ShivBaba(no. 1 shivshakti) are preet-buddhi (koto mein koi 108) and those who are voting for Baba Dixit ( Krishna'soul ) are vipreet buddhi. (16000).

shivsena.

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by shivsena » 17 Mar 2011

To all pbk brothers.

Sharing an important point about "blind faith on Krishna".

Murli 8-7-88 says: "Bhakti-marg ko kaha jaata hai "andh-shraddha ka marg"...manushya andh-shraddha se talab mein jakar snanan karte hain.....samajte hain amrut hai, isse dukh door ho jaayenge.....manushya ka buddhi-Yoga chala jaata hai Krishna ki taraf....parantu deh-dhari Krishna ko Yaad karne se vikarm vinash nahin ho sakte."
[meaning; "Bhakti-marg is called the path of blind faith...humans(PBKs) blindly take bath in the lake(of advance knowledge)....they(PBKs) think that this(AK) is nectar and it will liberate them from sorrow.....humans(PBKs) intellect is linked to Krishna (Baba Dixit)....but remembering deh-dhari Krishna(Baba dixit) will not burn their sins."]

The above Murli point spoken by shiv before 1969 clearly emerges the humans(PBKs) of the behad ka drama and says that Ak is the path of blind faith, where PBKs have mistaken baba Dixit(Krishna) to be personified ShivBaba and have linked their intellect to deh-dhari Krishna(baba Dixit) and remembering Krishna will not burn their sins.

BKs would interpret the above point with reference to the outside world and Krishna of the broad drama.....PBKs would interpret the above point with reference to the bk world and DL Krishna.

But imo, the above point describes the manushya of the pbk world who have accepted Baba Dixit-Krishna(as personified God Ramshivbaba) without any concrete proofs from Murlis.....imo, whenever the word "Krishna" is spoken in Murlis by shiv, it is for Baba Dixit(Krishna's soul) and not for Krishna of the outside world...and whenever the word "manushya" is spoken, it is for "PBKs" of the behad ka drama and not for outside manushya (who are not in the knowledge and going to take 83 births or less.)

shivsena.

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by arjun » 17 Mar 2011

shivsena wrote:But imo, the above point describes the manushya of the PBK world who have accepted Baba Dixit-Krishna(as personified God Ramshivbaba) without any concrete proofs from Murlis
You are free to believe Baba Virendra Dev Dixit as Krishna.

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by Roy » 20 Mar 2011

shivsena wrote:imo, whenever the word "Krishna" is spoken in Murlis by shiv, it is for Baba Dixit(Krishna's soul) and not for Krishna of the outside world
Dear Shivsena Bhai

Although confluence aged Krishna(Baba Dixit) is spoken about in the Murli, so is Shri Krishna, child Prince of the Golden Age. Whenever Baba refers to the question of, "who is God of the Gita?" in the Murli, he compares Himself with the child Krishna(Brahma Baba) of the Golden Age, not Confluence Age Krishna(Baba Dixit).

God Shri Krishna speaks. In that case Shri Krishna comes first and the Gita comes after him. A creator of the Gita is definitely needed. If Shri Krishna is called that, then Shri Krishna should come first, and then the Gita. However, Shri Krishna was a small child and so he couldn't have spoken the Gita. You have to prove who it was who gave birth to the Gita. This is a deep matter. Krishna took birth from his mother's womb; he was a prince of the Golden Age. He attained the status of a prince by studying Raja Yoga through the Gita. So who was the One who gave birth to the Gita? Was it the Supreme Father, the Supreme Soul Shiva or Shri Krishna? In fact, Shri Krishna cannot even be called trilokinath or Trikaldarshi. Only the One can be called Trilokinath and Trikaldarshi. Trilokinath means the One who rules the Three Worlds. The incorporeal world, the Subtle Region and the corporeal world are called triloki, and the One who knows these three is called Trilokinath, Trikaldarshi, the Supreme Father, the Supreme Soul, Shiva. This is His praise, not Shri Krishna's praise. The praise of Krishna is: Sixteen celestial degrees full, full of all virtues. He is compared to the moon. [Mu 11.11.08]
shivsena wrote:[meaning; "Bhakti-marg is called the path of blind faith...humans(PBKs) blindly take bath in the lake(of advance knowledge)....they(PBKs) think that this(AK) is nectar and it will liberate them from sorrow.....humans(PBKs) intellect is linked to Krishna (Baba Dixit)....but remembering deh-dhari Krishna(Baba dixit) will not burn their sins."]
Now the festival of the birth of Krishna is coming and you have to explain to them that Krishna was a small child. The night and day of Brahma is remembered. Krishna exists in the day of Brahma and Brahma exists in the night of Brahma. Brahma is the one who later becomes Krishna. [23.08.08]

I feel this point, goes some way in disproving your theory above, because you believe Baba Dixit is Ravan, and therefore cannot be called Brahma(one who God enters to narrate Gyan). Therefore by your own theory, it must be Brahma Baba(DL) who is being spoken of, as the one who becomes child Krishna in the Golden Age.

Who causes the confusion about who is the God of the Gita in the Conflunce Age, that results in the belief that it is Krishna in the Copper Age? Who placed the word Pitashri in front of ShivBaba, in the title of the Murlis, after Mama passed away, due to their attachment for a bodily being? Who is ShivBaba most likely referring to in the Murli point above, in connection with this?

Roy

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by shivsena » 05 Apr 2011

Dear roy Bhai and pbk brothers.

Avaykt Vani 1-1-79 says: "paramatma milan manane ke tekhedaron se thak gaye hain..samajte hain kuch aur, aur satya kuch aur hai....satyata ki manzil ki khoj mein hai."
["souls are fed up of the contractors who claim to meet the souls with Supreme Soul..they understand that truth is something else..they are in search of the final truth."]

BKs would interpret the above point as the outside world souls are fed up of deh-dhari dharm gurus(contractors who claim to connect the souls to GOD) and are now in search of the truth.

PBKs apply this on the bk world thinking that BKs are fed up of Dadis and Didis(contractors) and BKs are seeking the truth.

But in reality the biggest contractor (Baba Dixit claiming that souls are meeting God in person) is present in the pbk world and in last 20 years most PBKs who are fed up of this contractor are leaving the Advance Party and have seriously started thinking that truth is somewhere else.

What is the truth nobody knows.

So the same point(as every point in Murli and Vani) can be interpreted differently depending on the platform from which you see it.

shivsena.

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by Roy » 05 Apr 2011

shivsena wrote:So the same point(as every point in Murli and Vani) can be interpreted differently depending on the platform from which you see it.
Yes, this is true of course; and it is one's interpretation or understanding of these points, that decides our numberwise position, in the scheme of this predestined Drama.

We simply have to play out our fixed parts, according to Drama!

Roy

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by shivsena » 08 Apr 2011

Dear roy Bhai and pbk brothers.

Another point which can be interpreted in 3 ways:

Murli 23-1-01 says: "Ram-vanshi aur Ravan-vanshi ki yudh chalti hai....tum Bap ke bacche ho...woh Ravan ke bacche hai".
[meaning: " there is battle between Ram's children and Ravan's children.....you(108) are Father's children and they(PBKs) are Ravan's children."]

The above point will be interpreted by BKs as the outside world are Ravan's children (children of 5 vices) and they are nirakar Ram's children.
PBKs would interpret it as BKs are Ravan's children and they are Ram's(baba dixit's) children.

Potential 108 would consider that PBKs are Ravan's children (one who teaches them that God shiv is revealed through 3 bodies) and 108 are Ram-parampita paramatma's (combined mat-pita shivshakti's) children.

Only in the end it will be seen who are Ram's children and who are Ravan's children.

shivsena.

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by Roy » 09 Apr 2011

shivsena wrote:Potential 108 would consider that PBKs are Ravan's children (one who teaches them that God shiv is revealed through 3 bodies)and 108 would be Ram-parampita paramatma's (combined mat-pita shivshakti's) children.
I believe you may be correct Shivsena Bhai; ShivBaba is speaking to the 108 about these matters. But this is not because the 108 remember a fairy in the sky(sorry!); it is because the 108 are truly soul conscious, and defeat Ravan(five vices). Even the 16000, do not come close to beating Ravan(five vices), before the too late board is raised, in 2018, imo. Therefore, they remain Ravan's(body conscious, relatively speaking) children, even at this point. However, i think ShivBaba may be referring mainly to the Ravana Community of the BK world, though i am not sure about this.

Roy

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by shivsena » 10 Apr 2011

Roy wrote:However, i think ShivBaba may be referring mainly to the Ravana Community of the BK world, though i am not sure about this.
Roy
If bk world is Ravan community, then who is their head at present ??....and are all bk students (sitas) held in captivity(in Ravan Rajya), are they experiencing sorrow ???

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by arjun » 10 Apr 2011

shivsena wrote:If BK world is Ravan community, then who is their head at present ??....and are all BK students (sitas) held in captivity(in Ravan Rajya), are they experiencing sorrow ???
Ravan rules through his numerous heads, who give numerous directions.

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by shivsena » 12 Apr 2011

Roy wrote: However, i think ShivBaba may be referring mainly to the Ravana Community of the BK world, Roy
Dear roy Bhai.

If ShivBaba is refering to Ravan community of the bk world, then why is it said in Murlis that "Bharat mein hi Ram-rajya, Bharat mein hi Ravan-rajya"....chaitanya Bharat is present in the pbk world and not in the bk world.

shivsena.

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by arjun » 12 Apr 2011

shivsena wrote:If ShivBaba is refering to Ravan community of the BK world, then why is it said in Murlis that "Bharat mein hi Ram-rajya, Bharat mein hi Ravan-rajya"....chaitanya Bharat is present in the PBK world and not in the BK world.
Chaitanya Bharat also comes under Ravan Rajya whenever and to whatever extent he violates Shrimat during the Confluence Age.

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by Roy » 12 Apr 2011

shivsena wrote:If ShivBaba is refering to Ravan community of the bk world, then why is it said in Murlis that "Bharat mein hi Ram-rajya, Bharat mein hi Ravan-rajya"....chaitanya Bharat is present in the pbk world and not in the bk world.
Dear Shivsena Bhai

I think this is the point you may have mentioned before, to which i gave my opinion, that i believed it referred to Bharat the land, not the living Bharat(Baba Dixit); although i do take on board, Arjun Bhai's point! However!... i feel when ShivBaba is contrasting Ram's children, with Ravan's children; this is most likely relating to the BK world(Ravan raj), who don't understand Ram's role, and the PBK world(Ram raj) that does. That is not to say all of Ram's children are free of Ravan, as they clearly are not... but they have a least recognised(numberwise) the body, through which the practical role of Ram is being played, by Father Shiv; and this is the distinction, ShivBaba may be making here.

Roy

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Re: Three interpretations of Murli & Vani points.

Post by shivsena » 14 Apr 2011

Roy wrote:
.. i feel when ShivBaba is contrasting Ram's children, with Ravan's children; this is most likely relating to the BK world(Ravan raj), who don't understand Ram's role, and the PBK world(Ram raj) that does.
Roy
Dear roy Bhai.

This is where we have completely different beliefs:
PBKs believe that BKs are Ravan-rajya and they are Ram-rajya and i believe that pbk world is Ravan-rajya and only those who believe in Ram parampita paramatma(combined mother-Father ie no. 1 shivshakti) will be in Ram-rajya....the battle is now about who is Ram's soul....PBKs believe that baba Dixit is Ram....whereas i believe that Baba Dixit is playing the role of Ravan and Ram is Mama(parampita paramatma no 1 soul) who will come in the end as ShivBaba to liberate everyone from the clutches of Ravan.(role of baba dixit).

If in the end, baba Dixit is revealed as Ram, then i loose.....if on the other hand, Mama is revealed as Ramshivbaba, then PBKs loose.....so let us wait and watch which side grows stronger over the next few years (it is said in Murli: "Abhi Bhakti ka palda bhari hai...dheere dheere Gyan ka palda bhari hota jaaega"------"now the scales are in favour of Bhakti-marg....slowly the scales will be in favour of Gyan-marg.").

shivsena.

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