Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

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cal
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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by cal » 30 Mar 2008

shivsena wrote:So you do agree that we all are doing Bhakti in the unlimited sense and only when this shooting period is complete that the true Gita Gyan will emerge from Ramshivbaba who will make us complete soul-conscious or karmateet stage.
Dear Brother Shivsena,
There are various quotes where you have written about the "shooting period". (I do not recall a mention of shooting period when I was a BK).
Is Shooting Period mentioned in the Murlis? Or is shooting period a reference only in Advanced Knowledge?
Om Shanti - Cal

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by shivsena » 31 Mar 2008

arjun wrote: Baba tells in the Murlis that we should all try to make the (spiritually) dead ones to smell the sanjivani booti (the life saving herb of Ramayana fame) instead of causing the (spiritual) death of someone through our words or actions.
Dear arjun Bhai.
All BKs and PBKs are in fact committing spiritual suicide by not recognising the 100% Nirakari stage of Ram's soul and calling HIM Ravan, prajapita, Bharat etc. i have accepted HIM as my true spiritual Father (roohani bap) and i am trying to give the PBKs the true sanjeevni booty by giving them the right introduction of their eternal spiritual Father and you are mentioning the absolutely the reverse.

We will see in the end who is doing real Godly service: BKs or PBKs who are giving the introduction of bindishiv in the body of Lekhraj Kirpalani and Virendra Dev Dixit, or the potential 108 souls who have recognised Ram's 100% nirakari stage as Ramshivbaba and are trying to glorify and reveal HIM in the pbk world.

shivsena.

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by arjun » 31 Mar 2008

Dear Shivsena Bhai,
Om Shanti. Thanks for the reply and good luck. :)
With regards,
OGS,
Arjun

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by shivsena » 31 Mar 2008

cal wrote:There are various quotes where you have written about the "shooting period". (I do not recall a mention of shooting period when I was a BK). Is Shooting Period mentioned in the Murlis? Or is shooting period a reference only in Advanced Knowledge?
Dear cal Bhai.
Your observation is very correct; i have not come across any phrase of 'shooting-period' in the Murlis which i have been reading for last 8 years. But there are many indirect and obvious evidences that the shooting of the whole drama of 5000 years takes place in Sangamyug.

Please go through the Murli points below.

  • "Yeh Sangamyugi rahasmaiy drama hi bhavishya mein repeat hoga".(meaning that this mysterious drama of Sangamyug will be repeated in future).
    "Yeh hai behad ka drama aur woh hai hadh ka drama"( meaning that this is the subtle unlimited drama and that is the limited drama(5000 years).
    "Brahma ki raat(Dwapur Kaliyug) aur brahma ka din(Satyug treta)" (since Brahma does not exist in the broad drama of 5000 years, it is assumed that the shooting of all 4 ages goes on in a subtle manner when brahma is present in Sangamyug).

As regards how this shooting takes place and the period (when to when) it takes place i am not able to understand completely so far; all i know is that since 1988-89, Krishna ki pratyakshta took place in Advance Party(since that one year brahma did not go to mt abu to recite av. Vani) and from that time onwards the advance knowledge came in full force(even though the seeds of advance knowledge were sown in 1976). So, i presume that brahma ki raat has started from 1988-89 and since then in last 20 years, the advance knowledge has been progressing rapidly but the degradation and degeneration and dis-integration of PBKs has also taken place as time passed by, and so i am inclined to believe (as per Murlis) that the whole advance knowledge is Krishna ki jhooti Gita, which is causing the downfall of PBKs.

shivsena.

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by andrey » 02 Apr 2008

VCD 434 (Sakar Murli 25.2.67)

"Now whose ever children you are - to ask the Father, the sister, or some brother, that "Teach me to remember my Father!" it becomes wrong. Those who are children will themselves remember, or will they ask "Teach me to remember!"? In lokik does someone say that "Teach me to remember!"? The children themselves remember.

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by pbktrinityshiva » 04 Apr 2008

Remember yourself as a Soul, and establish the atmic connection with the Supreme Father through the forehead of the Supreme Chariot ...

This is only like hatha Yoga if one is opposite from the Father both in terms of not having a good atmic stage or directly in opposition due to one's shooting ...

Just because many PBK experience it to be difficult does not mean the method is incorrect, it only means the goal is high. For those making efforts in soul concious stage there will be no question of Hatha Yoga.

From my personal experience when my stage is not so good then it becomes hard to remember Father ... When I have made solid efforts in Amrit Vela then there is no question of difficulty but only the experience of power and bliss. 8)
shivsena wrote:Again PBKs believe that accurate rememberance is "Sakar mein nirakar ko Yaad karo"; again if we take this literally than PBKs first emerge Ram's body (Veerendra Dev Dixit) and then concentrate on his forehead and remember bindi ShivBaba (out of 3 bindis); but this method also has not been able to produce any result, as the whole PBK family is going downhill inspite of remembering Shiva; The words of Shiva are again to be interpreted in behad ka sense ie. when Krishna's soul becomes 100% saakari through the body of Veerendra Dev Dixit and Ram becomes 100% nirakari through the same body, then you have to remember nirakari stage of Ramshivbaba (and not bindi) in the same body which now belongs to Krishna (sakaari bap Prajapita).
Shivsena, Whilst we are waiting for Ram to become 100% nirakari from whom should we obtain Shrimat? Will you guide us? If not then whom? Ourselves or another Chariot?

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by suryavanshi » 04 Apr 2008

shivsena wrote:So you do agree that we all are doing Bhakti in the unlimited sense and only when this shooting period is complete that the true Gita Gyan will emerge from Ramshivbaba who will make us complete soul-conscious or karmateet stage.
So then what are we debating about?? i too believe this.
When the Shooting period( or call it as the subtle Bhakti) will end for a PBK soul, from that moment one would be in Heaven practically i.e complete constant soul conscious and not intermittent soul conscious. When one has become or has achieved this state, one is called "Gyani" because soul consciousness only is real "Gyan" or Knowledge and body consciousness is real "Agyan" or Bhakti. " Dehabhimaani sabhi hain Bhaktimarg waale, Aatmaabhimaani hain Gyan marg waale" mu dated. 4/7/1968.

So, when one has achieved that state, that state itself is real Gyan and PBK's would reach that state numberwise (first bead to last bead) because they will finish their body consciousness(subtle Bhakti) number wise and thus there is no scope of any new Gyan coming from any other new ShivBaba.

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by cal » 05 Apr 2008

suryavanshi wrote:So, when one has achieved that state, that state itself is real Gyan and PBK's would reach that state numberwise (first bead to last bead) because they will finish their body consciousness (subtle Bhakti) number wise and thus there is no scope of any new Gyan coming from any other new ShivBaba.
Dear Suryawanshi Bhai:
Based on your quote, after soul conscious state is reached, there is nothing to learn. But the Murli says "Jub atma ki kut puri utregi toh tum baap se directly padenge".

Since we are not rohani (reached that state yet), "rohani baap rohani bacchon ko namaste" and "rohani baap rohani bacchon ko rohani baate batate hai" is it valid for the current period or only when we have achieved that state?

Your views awaited.
OS - cal

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by suryavanshi » 05 Apr 2008

Your observation is very correct; i have not come across any phrase of 'shooting-period' in the Murlis which i have been reading for last 8 years.
Dear Brother,

There is in fact a direct mention (instead of indirect mention) in the Murli about the current period(period of Sangamyug) being a shooting period. The word "shooting" is not invented by any human soul (Krishna according to you) but it is the word directly uttered by Supreme Soul Shiv in the Murli through Brahma Baba which is being clarified in depth by ShivBaba through Virendra Dev Dixit. Below is that sentence from the Murli which indicate about the shooting period.


" is samay jo act chali shoot huaa. isko drama kahenge anaadi banaa banaayaa drama hain. ismein koi farak nahi pad sakta." mu 19/4/1978. (at this time, whatever act occurs shooting takes place.this is called drama which is never created but exist endlessly. nothing can be changed in this.)

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by arjun » 05 Apr 2008

cal wrote:There are various quotes where you have written about the "shooting period". (I do not recall a mention of shooting period when I was a BK).
Is Shooting Period mentioned in the Murlis? Or is shooting period a reference only in Advanced Knowledge?
Om Shanti - Cal
Dear brother,
Suryavanshi Bhai has produced a relevant Murli quote which proves that the word 'shooting' is not an invention of the advanced knowledge but nevertheless the detailed explanation of the shooting period was given only in the advanced knowledge.

It is also mentioned in some old Avyakt Vanis that Brahmin souls are law makers for the entire Kalpa. Whatever actions Brahmins perform in the Confluence Age becomes the basis for the actions performed by their followers in the broad drama, i.e. 5000 years drama. It is also mentioned that we are all actors on this world stage and any action performed by us will be copied by others, whether good or bad.

It is also mentioned in the Murlis/AVs that every second/breath of the Confluence Age is very important because it is equal to a year in the broad drama. It is also said that all the rituals, scriptures, festivals of the path of worship are a memorial of the actions performed in the Confluence Age.

All these things mentioned in the Murlis/AVs are like the rudimentary knowledge of shooting period, which was expanded in the advanced knowledge.
Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by shivsena » 05 Apr 2008

suryavanshi wrote: There is in fact a direct mention (instead of indirect mention) in the Murli about the current period(period of Sangamyug) being a shooting period. The word "shooting" is not invented by any human soul (Krishna according to you) but it is the word directly uttered by Supreme Soul Shiv in the Murli through Brahma Baba which is being clarified in depth by ShivBaba through Veerendra Dev Dixit. Below is that sentence from the Murli which indicate about the shooting period.
Dear suryavanshi Bhai.

Is the shooting period of brahma ki raat(dwpur-Kaliyug) done by Shiva or Krishna(brahma).

I have always believed in the shooting period but according to you it is shiv who is doing the shooting of brahma ki raat and i believe that it is brahma(Krishna) who is doing the shooting of jhooti Krishna ki Gita.

shivsena.

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by shivsena » 05 Apr 2008

pbktrinityshiva wrote: Shivsena, Whilst we are waiting for Ram to become 100% nirakari from whom should we obtain Shrimat? Will you guide us? If not then whom? Ourselves or another Chariot?
Dear trinity Bhai.
My manthan says that there cannot be any Shrimat during the shooting period and Shrimat will be given only in the end, when Shri Shri Ramshivbaba comes on the scene and p. Sangamyug starts; till then the duty of all BKs and PBKs is to study the Murlis of Shiva and Vanis to know the practical form of God ie Ramshivbaba and the Godly form of Maya(as mentioned in the Vanis); only those souls who study and solve this mystery will be eligible to real Shrimat which will emerge from Shri Shri Ramshivbaba.(which will give mukti-jeevanmukti in one second to those who hear it).

shivsena.

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by andrey » 05 Apr 2008

dear brother shivsena,

Is the Supreme Soul Shiv doing any shooring at all? Shiv is akarta - he does not do anything. It is we the souls who with our acts shoot our fate of the 5000 years drama during the Confluence Age, whilst the Supreme Soul Shiv remains a detached observer of this, being in a corporeal body in the same way as he is not engaged in the 5000 years drama. His role is to give knowledge according to which we shoot our heaven and hell. There is general shooting, but also every soul has its own inividual shooting that starts with his entering the path of knowledge. As there is also a shooting of the Confluence Age in the Confluence Age itself maybe this can be a time of some special revelation that will fulfill you hopes.

The Golden Age and Silver Age is the kingdom of Rama that is free from Maya and CoA and Iron Age is the kingdom of Maya. The Confluence Age is the time where on the one side there is Maya and on the other the Father as explained in the Murlis about the tug of war between Maya and Father taht we are in between. I have posed this question to you but don't remember to have received the satisfactory answer that if Krishna is playing the role of Maya now practically who and where is the practical role of Father. Then if you say that Krishna plays the role of Father through the body of the Father then why it is said that where there is Father there is no Maya.

Dear brother cal,

You should know the clarification of the saying that "on removing the rust from the soul we will learn from the Father directly" clarified by Baba (in Virendra Dev Dixit), that these souls who after taking the basic knowledge and practicing the rememberance of a point of light remove the rust from the basically, they reach the Advance Party where they learn directly from the Father. Is there not Father in the Advance Party from which the PBKs study directly and is there a direct Father in the BK, but maybe you expect or you have some other explanation?

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by cal » 05 Apr 2008

andrey wrote:You should know the clarification of the saying that "on removing the rust from the soul we will learn from the Father directly" clarified by Baba (in Veerendra Dev Dixit), that these souls who after taking the basic knowledge and practicing the rememberance of a point of light remove the rust from the basically,
Dear Brother Andrey,

I agree basically the kut (rust) has been removed as said in the clarifications. But the Murli says "puri kut uterneke baad" (after complete rust has been removed). I am emphasing on the word puri (complete).

The day that I became a PBK I interpreted the same way as you have. But after listening to the clarifications, I realized that puri kut toh utri nahi hai (complete rust has not been removed), not at least mine.
suryavanshi wrote:" is samay jo act chali shoot huaa. isko drama kahenge anaadi banaa banaayaa drama hain. ismein koi farak nahi pad sakta." mu 19/4/1978. (at this time, whatever act occurs shooting takes place.this is called drama which is never created but exist endlessly. nothing can be changed in this.)
Dear Brother Suryawanshi,

Thanks for the Murli reference, I was unaware of it.
OS

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Re: Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Post by suryavanshi » 05 Apr 2008

Based on your quote, after soul conscious state is reached, there is nothing to learn. But the Murli says "Jub atma ki kut puri utregi toh tum baap se directly padenge".
Since we are not rohani (reached that state yet), "rohani baap rohani bacchon ko namaste" and "rohani baap rohani bacchon ko rohani baate batate hai" is it valid for the current period or only when we have achieved that state?
Dear Brother,

"Kut ootarna" is not a single day process. It can be compared to the healing process of a physical disease which definitely demands time and is a gradual process which is continuously going on inside the soul.Here, it is healing of the soul and not the body. Today the kut is relatively less than yesterday and tomorrow the kut will be relatively lesser than today and so on.....So, understanding of knowledge from Father and remembrance of Father is also relatively more direct than it was yesterday and will be relatively more direct tomorrow than it is today and so on....At a point in time , soul will have reached a state when there will be no kut and would now be able to understand His same versions more clearly and therefore will realize the 84 births of the self more quickly and completely than it is able to do so today because of relatively more kut today than that final stage of no kut or roohani stage. At that stage when one has realized the 84 births in this world drama, there is no desire or in fact no scope of any new knowledge which the soul requires and the soul would now not lapse into body consciousness again and therefore can be called as real or 'true' Gyani(constantly soul conscious) who knows the self and would no longer be called a foolish actor as it is called today.

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